Killing colonies

[Newbeeneil]

I had a meeting with landlords of one of my out apiaries. I keep my bees at the bottom of their meadow, on the line of a disused railway. They live in the old station which has has bees in it for decades and I set bait hives to try to prevent too many new colonies setting up in the house. This year I caught two swarms but two others set up residence in the cavity wall and in the gap below the first floor it seems.
Recently the owner who is a musician in his eighties, has been stung twice by guard bees from one of these new colonies while watering pots on the platform. The second sting has caused his arm to swell like a balloon and he's keen to get rid of these errant bees. It's not really feasible to dismantle the wall or floors to get to the brood so it looks like they will have to be poisoned.
Any recommendations for what they should be looking for in a pest controller who could do the work?
I would like seal the holes and trap them out but the months it will take to complete is too long for the owners.
Any thoughts would be welcome.
Cheers
N

 

[B+.]

Any recommendations for what they should be looking for in a pest controller who could do the work?
I would like seal the holes and trap them out but the months it will take to complete is too long for the owners.
Any thoughts would be welcome.
Cheers
N

I have used "expanding foam wasp nest destroyer" (a Rentokill product in a back/yellow can) when asked to destroy a colony in the walls of a listed building. It expands like shaving foam but doesn't seal the cavity permanently so you might like to recommend this is done too.

 

[For want of a better word]

With some pest control companies charging in excess ( or is it excessive) £500 to eradicate bees from cavities, chimneys and other places the common beekeeper should or can not safely access...
Check to see if pest removal is covered by their household insurers!
Chons da

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

DM Karol: he has excellent and safe ideas on this sort of thing.

Also, as this reads you are incredibly lucky with your landlord being so patient. In his position I, a dck Londoner, would be irritated by what seems to be insufficient attention given to preventing swarms which we all know are going to be a major nuisance to me. That's a lot of swarms in those circumstances.

And don't even think of insurance: you think _I_'m a dck, try them. The certain result would be no payout and likely loss of the site as the insurer pulled 3rd party cover etc etc (IMO).

 

[Stiffy]

I have used "expanding foam wasp nest destroyer" (a Rentokill product in a back/yellow can) when asked to destroy a colony in the walls of a listed building. It expands like shaving foam but doesn't seal the cavity permanently so you might like to recommend this is done too.

Thanks very useful.
I have been asked a few times from apiary owners who have discovered swarms in their property and automatically think mine have swarmed, sometimes they are correct and they are mine but more often than not they are wrong.
I have always shied away from tackling killing the bees as I don't have experience or knowledge of the products to use and suggested they contact a pest controller. I may, if I can bring myself to do the dirty deed try this product on the next one.
S

 

[bingevader]

Please ask them to make as good a job as possible at sealing the holes up!
I knew of someone who, for several years, rang to complain of bees in the fascia and killed them each year, but took a heck of a lot of persuasion to do a decent job of sealing the entrance.
I hasten to add, this was before I had bees anywhere near!

 

[Ian123]

Your also on sticky ground regarding contaminated honey and poisoning other beeks bees and your own, few if any buildings are bee/insect tight and even if you fill the entrance others are likely to remain. I think there was an instance some years back of exactly the same involving a pest controller who ended up heavily fined, hence why the removal of contaminated comb is recommended/required.

 

[Newbeeneil]

DM Karol: he has excellent and safe ideas on this sort of thing.

Also, as this reads you are incredibly lucky with your landlord being so patient. In his position I, a dck Londoner, would be irritated by what seems to be insufficient attention given to preventing swarms which we all know are going to be a major nuisance to me. That's a lot of swarms in those circumstances.

And don't even think of insurance: you think _I_'m a dck, try them. The certain result would be no payout and likely loss of the site as the insurer pulled 3rd party cover etc etc (IMO).

I think I was a bit lax in explaining but these are not my swarms but swarms from the resident colonies which I regularly get swarms from in my bait hives.
In the last 3 years I have kept bees in this apiary I have not lost a swarm and picked up 6 in bait hives.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

I think I was a bit lax in explaining but these are not my swarms but swarms from the resident colonies which I regularly get swarms from in my bait hives.
In the last 3 years I have kept bees in this apiary I have not lost a swarm and picked up 6 in bait hives.

Ah! That makes more sense! As I said: "As this reads..."

Do DM Karol: all the points about poisoning above are valid. Find a way to force abscondment maybe? Others seem to find it easy enough to have swarms abscond... Regular sprays of a rotten, alcoholic sort of mixture that you end up with in wasp traps or similar, maybe?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Do DM Karol

I think he's a bit bust at the moment - sitting on top of a mountain somewhere waiting for the end of the world as sunspots have appeared on Uranus

 

[Ian123]

This spring a swarm went into a flat roof on a pub I arrived after they all entered I worked out the way the joists ran drilled a hole behind them and squirted in some bee quick. The result was bees exiting rather quickly and clustering at the front. I’ve also used this trick on bait hives or old hives that are hard to inspect, in those instances you can then cut out comb if needed bee free. I doubt you would need more than a hammer drill 12mm a 150-200mm long drill bit and large syringe with maybe some tube for the end to reach the cavity. I should say the wholes are easily filled with the fibre roof repair paste, expensive if you have to buy it but not if you have half a tin in the garage.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

Yes: Beequick came up in an earlier thread on here https://beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=22955

 

[ericbeaumont]

Your also on sticky ground regarding contaminated honey and poisoning other beeks bees and your own, few if any buildings are bee/insect tight and even if you fill the entrance others are likely to remain. I think there was an instance some years back of exactly the same involving a pest controller who ended up heavily fined, hence why the removal of contaminated comb is recommended/required.

Last paragraph of this Rentokil blog: Many insecticides are capable of killing bees, their biology is not too dissimilar to that of pest species, so there is a risk of ‘non-target’ poisoning. A high profile prosecution in 2008 related to the misuse of a carbamate insecticide that led to the death of naturally foraging non-target bees.

The prosecution was successful and no doubt fueled the belief that the pest controller in question was fined for killing a protected species rather than misuse of chemicals. Interestingly, the defendant was on record stating that bees were protected.

 

[B+.]

Thanks very useful.
I have been asked a few times from apiary owners who have discovered swarms in their property and automatically think mine have swarmed, sometimes they are correct and they are mine but more often than not they are wrong.
I have always shied away from tackling killing the bees as I don't have experience or knowledge of the products to use and suggested they contact a pest controller. I may, if I can bring myself to do the dirty deed try this product on the next one.
S

I think we're all blamed for swarms - no matter where they come from. In my case, I KNOW it's not mine as all my queens are numbered/marked as soon as they emerge. If the queen is still in her colony, they can't have swarmed!
The thing about destroying a colony that has swarmed into a property is that you should wait until after dusk when most of the foragers have returned. I'm sure commercial pest exterminators can't/don't do this but it's the best way to get the majority of the colony all in one go. A few foragers may well return the next day but there will be a fraction of those that would come back if it were done during the day while they were out foraging.
The foam smells a bit like petrol so returning foragers are reluctant to go in. They usually aren't a problem and disappear altogether within a few days. Whether they die or beg their way into another colony, I can't say.

 

[Newbeeneil]

I thought I'd update you all. I have been asked to try to milk the bees out of the building. I know the Queen won't budge but if I can get the bulk of the bees out over the next couple of months both the home owner and I will feel we tried and didn't resort to poisoning.
I've got boxes made to bolt to the side of the building with one way valves ( basically a series of bee escapes) and I'll be blocking up any holes as bees try to exit or enter them. I'll put some open brood in the boxes so the returning bees who can't get back into the hive will have a focus. Just hope they don't find their way inside!!
Wish me luck!

 

[The Poot in Somerset]

Yes indeed, good luck. I hope things turn out well.