Hive abandoned for 5 years

[bee-live]

There are 2 "unmanaged" hives less than 50 yards from mine that I discovered almost 4 years ago. I go and have a look at them quite often and sometimes lift their roof (they have propolis and brace comb everywhere, so everything is well stack). They have survived 3 winters without any human help and they doing well. I have a swarm from last year than is also doing well without any treatment. Its a experiment and hope my queens mate with their drones so they will act as genetic pull. Someone studying feral colonies collected samples from these hives and they happen to be genetically ~60% Apis MM!!!
Is it a coincidence?

 

[Brosville]

I'm of the opinion that feral or untreated colonies may well be the saviour of bees in the UK - if they manage to stay healthy and shrug off varroa untreated, their progeny will be invaluable to beekeepers.
What worries me greatly is that there are those who will endeavour to "treat" or wipe out feral colonies under the mistaken impression they are doing a good thing, when they may in fact be doing the dead opposite........

 

[Hivemaker.]

Someone studying feral colonies collected samples from these hives and they happen to be genetically ~60% Apis MM!!!
Is it a coincidence?

I don't think so,i believe imports have helped.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?p=216464#post216464

 

[TheDragons]

Thanks for the replies - I'm surprised so many are saying to leave alone, I thought the majority would be to get involved in the hive.
I'll ask if I can have a look (if I can get in!) and make a decision after that - if they look healthy I might leave alone. Good advice on disinfecting my tools after.

 

[Poly Hive]

Have you considered that they are not a long stay colony but a series of re-colonisations? Especially if the "owners" are not too bee aware.

PH

 

[bee-live]

I don't think so,i believe imports have helped.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?p=216464#post216464

I'm not suggesting pure AMM are the answer, otherwise Darwing and evolution would be wrong. As it will be wrong as importing queens from down under and trying to keep them pure.
I think that having a a good mongrel with a large proportion of what it used to be local bees+some natural selection may be the future for Beekeping.

 

[Beeforest]

I'm of the opinion that feral or untreated colonies may well be the saviour of bees in the UK - if they manage to stay healthy and shrug off varroa untreated, their progeny will be invaluable to beekeepers.
What worries me greatly is that there are those who will endeavour to "treat" or wipe out feral colonies under the mistaken impression they are doing a good thing, when they may in fact be doing the dead opposite........

Can only agree with that.

 

[AnotherNewBee]

I think that having a a good mongrel with a large proportion of what it used to be local bees+some natural selection may be the future for Beekeping.

I've always thought a good Heinz 57 mutt is usually healthier than most pedigrees. Perhaps the same is true of bees?

 

[drstitson]

yes pure bred animals (bees included) may have specific defects/weaknesses.

hybrids will display vigour in F1 generation and then lose it as they become a random jumble of mixed characters.

Local mongrels will be well adapted for local conditions but within reason - problem is well meaning beeks keeping iffy colonies alive which should by rights die off or being hands off beeks and flooding area with swarmy bees.

 

[thurrock bees]

Have you considered that they are not a long stay colony but a series of re-colonisations? Especially if the "owners" are not too bee aware.

PH

I had a small colony that died out while i was away, when i came back the was a unmarked Q there telling me a swarm had moved in, all in a space of 2 weeks !

 

[Hivemaker.]

I'm not suggesting pure AMM are the answer,

I know your not,thats why i am agreeing with you when you mentioned 60% Apis MM.

 

[Finman]

I think that having a a good mongrel with a large proportion of what it used to be local bees+some natural selection may be the future for Beekeping.

Future is artificial insemination, and has long been.

.

 

[REDWOOD]

Flip Finman what a photo this time of night glad it's past kids bed time lol looks like something from a SIFI horror move, I was going to post a question about sooty bees with no varroa but all I can see is that picture in my head,

 

[BeeJayBee]

I'm of the opinion that feral or untreated colonies may well be the saviour of bees in the UK - if they manage to stay healthy and shrug off varroa untreated, their progeny will be invaluable to beekeepers.

I think there is interest in these long-standing feral colonies, especially if they're in area where EFB has been found.

If we manage to capture a swarm from them this year we're not sure whether we will leave them untreated or not, although they would be monitored. Whatever course of action could carry life/death risks for the bees themselves, which makes it a difficult decision to make.

 

[Chris Luck]

I know it's France but we have had varroa longer than the UK and my colonies are definitely occupied continuously without messing or treatments and survive with varroa mites as do many feral colonies that I'm aware of in the locality.

Let the weak die, it's natures way. You may not get docile bees but then I never thought that keeping bees was for wimps.

Chris

 

[Chris B]

Let the weak die

That's not so easy to say when you only have 1 or 2 colonies which cost you upwards of £150 each.

 

[drstitson]

"That's not so easy to say when you only have 1 or 2 colonies which cost you upwards of £150 each."

sure - but performing ASs on them, ensuring you get good daughter queens and maybe taking off a couple of nucs as well should ensure that you have a core stock of strong hives to get through to next season (plus reserve nucs as replacements or to sell on).

 

[RoseCottage]

In terms of dealing with Varroa we can interfere on our managed colonies but I always thought that nature's way was to swarm and start a new colony...a little form of DR in nature.

I also firmly believe that there are colonies local to me that are continuously occupying sites.

all the best,
Sam

 

[Chris Luck]

That's not so easy to say when you only have 1 or 2 colonies which cost you upwards of £150 each.

Then it may be worth considering getting your stock from colonies that have been "surviving the mite" and HOW MUCH, upwards of £150???? That's €180+

€60 here.

Chris

 

[Dishmop]

€60 here.

Chris

oh go on............rub it in.