Happy St modomnoc's day

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Today is the saint's day of Modomnoc, patron saint of bees, beekeeper to saint David who on his return to Ireland was gifted bees by St David when they tried to follow him back home, thus Modomnoc also became the saint that introduced the first bees to Ireland

 

[pargyle]

Pancake day to the rest of us ....

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Pancake day to the rest of us ....

but that doesn't fall on the 13th of February every year, st Modomnoc's day does

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Today is the saint's day of Modomnoc, patron saint of bees, beekeeper to saint David who on his return to Ireland was gifted bees by St David when they tried to follow him back home, thus Modomnoc also became the saint that introduced the first bees to Ireland

Following bees? I'm not sure about that as a gift.

 

[Wilco]

Today is the saint's day of Modomnoc, patron saint of bees, beekeeper to saint David who on his return to Ireland was gifted bees by St David when they tried to follow him back home, thus Modomnoc also became the saint that introduced the first bees to Ireland

So you're saying AMM aren't native to Ireland?

(mods feel free to delete this if it's too cheeky).

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

we also sent our lunatics either North to ynys Môn - or South to Cernyw

 

[madasafish]

St Modomoc? The father of swarmy bees?

"It was time for St. Modomnoc to return to his native Ireland and start his priestly ministry...
St. Modomnoc got on the boat and departed for Ireland.


However, before he had sailed three miles he suddenly saw a small black cloud that was swiftly approaching from the Welsh coast. Soon the cloud drew near and the holy man to his great astonishment realized that these were the bees from all the beehives of the Mynyw Monastery"

..................................................."
Thus, Irish people from ancient times believe that the bees as well as beekeeping appeared in their country due to St. Modomnoc."

If true, bees are not native to Ireland.
https://orthochristian.com/77526.html

 

[Erichalfbee]

So you're saying AMM aren't native to Ireland?

(mods feel free to delete this if it's too cheeky).

Oh no. I love it.

 

[Erichalfbee]

If true, bees are not native to Ireland.

No. They came from Wales, then?

 

[bpmurray]

Just for those who think that bees arrived in Ireland around 500 AD with Modomnac, plenty of cere perdue artefacts have been found from the bronze age. Also, it's generally accepted by the National Museum, that Irish gold decorations were ceeated using that process from even earlier. That wax was definitely not transported in the quantities needed from far away, indicating the presence of bees in the country. Of course, there's no way of knowing if they were Amm, although the likelihood that they were is pretty close to 100%.

In any case, if the Modomnoc story were true, Ireland would have chosen him as our bee Saint. Instead, we have St. Gobnait, pictured below.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Irish gold decorations were ceeated using that process from even earlier. That wax was definitely not transported in the quantities needed from far away

you seem to conveniently forget how advanced the trade routes to/from and around the British isles were - even before the bronze age.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Saints and gods are all fairy tales
Or might they be Aes sídhe, Sith, or Tylwyth Teg

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Saints are all fairy tales

Not really - the majority were human and history have proven they existed. In Wales sant just meant a holy person - nothing to do with titles and 'miracles' made up by the vatican.
Dewi dyfrwr (Saint David) existed
Mother Theresa existed - so did John Paul, the title 'saint' is just by the by

 

[bpmurray]

you seem to conveniently forget how advanced the trade routes to/from and around the British isles were - even before the bronze age.

No I haven't. The locations and scale of the cere perdue finds indicate that there must have been a substantial local supply of beeswax. In any case, it would be very strange that people would trade wax and honey, yet not bees, so I have no doubt that bees were brought into Ireland around that time. It's certainly possible that they made their way across whatever islands were above water then, but it seems more likely that they arrived by boat, and it was thousands of years before Modomnoc.

 

[Wilco]

No I haven't. The locations and scale of the cere perdue finds indicate that there must have been a substantial local supply of beeswax. In any case, it would be very strange that people would trade wax and honey, yet not bees, so I have no doubt that bees were brought into Ireland around that time. It's certainly possible that they made their way across whatever islands were above water then, but it seems more likely that they arrived by boat, and it was thousands of years before Modomnoc.

So still not native then.

 

[bpmurray]

I believe that being around for 1500 years is considered native: Amm have been in Ireland North of 3000.

 

[Wilco]

No I haven't. The locations and scale of the cere perdue finds indicate that there must have been a substantial local supply of beeswax. In any case, it would be very strange that people would trade wax and honey, yet not bees, so I have no doubt that bees were brought into Ireland around that time. It's certainly possible that they made their way across whatever islands were above water then, but it seems more likely that they arrived by boat, and it was thousands of years before Modomnoc.

That means they were introduced.

Your words, not mine.

Thus not native, even if they became naturalised.

 

[JamezF]

I believe that being around for 1500 years is considered native: Amm have been in Ireland North of 3000.

That's about how long you have to have lived around here to be considered local, certainly.

James

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Brown hares have been around since the Romans allegedly introduced them over 1500 years ago and they are still considered 'naturalised' rather than native

 

[bpmurray]

Brown hares have been around since the Romans allegedly introduced them over 1500 years ago and they are still considered 'naturalised' rather than native

Funny you should pick hares. Ireland has Lepidus timidus hibernicus which is a native, in fact our only native lagomorph.