Double Brood Discussion & Poll

[Haughton Honey]

I thought it might be interesting to have a discussion specifically about using double brood boxes. Firstly, to try and find out how many beeks on here employ the technique and secondly to have a discussion about the pros and cons of it (nuc making vs. overwintering difficulties perhaps....etc etc).

For the record, I keep Nationals with double brood. The bottom box contains 11 frames and a dummy board. The top brood box usually contains 10 DN4 frames and a permanent frame feeder. This is my preferred set up for all of my colonies, which comprise of three different strain of bee.

Over to you guys and gals..............!



WPC

 

[Heather]

Unsure - is a National Deep classed as double- or does double really mean 2 basic National broods, which will work out as more frame area

 

[JCBrum]

I don't use double brood, but can see the attraction of being able to tilt the top box to look for activity in the middle of the nest.

How do you get on with a frame feeder in the top box ? Surely it defeats the facility for a quick 'tilt and look between the boxes' type of inspection ?

 

[JCBrum]

Unsure - is a National Deep classed as double- or does double really mean 2 basic National broods, which will work out as more frame area

Heather, I think a 'National Deep' is one standard brood box. (8" deep)

'Double brood' - means two of those.

An 'Nat.Extra Deep', is 14x12 and is equivalent to a 'Brood and a Half'..... (12" deep)

A 'Brood and a Half' is a 'Deep with a Shallow' on top. (shallow = 'super' size) (shallow = 5" deep)

apologies if you already know all this J.

 

[JCBrum]

I suppose you could say double shallow = Standard Deep, as well, but I don't know of anyone who ever does that for brood.

 

[Finno]

My mongrels display a wide variation in brood nest size. I only use double brood (standard national) or brood and half where it is forced on me. I try to provide laying space for the more prolific queens by using surplus brood to equalize colony size in the apiary. This winter I have two double brood, two brood and half and remainder (10) on single brood.
P Finnegan

 

[Somerford]

you need another option on the poll - occasionally, as I don't fit into the other categories !!

 

[mikethebee]

WPC
We use deep B.S.National brood boxes for everything all the frames are the same interchangable from brood to honey, 5 brood boxes to 1 hive
when the 2nd brood boxs gets full swap frames from top box to bottom. Everthing fits in its place no looking for suppers frames boxes
Note the hives are made of ply tantalized pressure treated.
Easy bee, keeping that’s us.
any questions.

 

[Black Comb]

I've tried double brood and didn't like it.
I'm changing to larger boxes - it will give me the option to vary the size of a single box.

 

[Haughton Honey]

you need another option on the poll - occasionally, as I don't fit into the other categories !!

Does "....Only During Summer Months, If Required" not work for you Somerford? Are you saying that you occasionally use them in the winter?!

 

[Haughton Honey]

How do you get on with a frame feeder in the top box ? Surely it defeats the facility for a quick 'tilt and look between the boxes' type of inspection ?

JC, given all of the current issues with supercedure and swarming cells and the fact that very often swarming cells are not just located at the base of a frame, I don't actually employ the 'tilt and look' method - I go through them physically, where necessary.

 

[Melbourne12]

As newbies, we've used single National brood boxes this year, but found that both hives became overcrowded at the height of the season. We're going to try 14x12 boxes next year. Double brood boxes, or brood and a half, seemed like a lot of extra manipulation, hence our choice.

 

[JCBrum]

JC, given all of the current issues with supercedure and swarming cells and the fact that very often swarming cells are not just located at the base of a frame, I don't actually employ the 'tilt and look' method - I go through them physically, where necessary.

Aha, I see. ..... 'tilt and look' does seem attractive, but I've always been a bit suspicious about the efficacy of it.

I suppose if you want to be sure you've got to be thorough.

 

[Hawklord]

I am using the standard national brood with a local mongrel bee but, being a newbee this year, haven't had to think about whether my choice of brood box will be big enough. I don't fancy the extra work of double brood and the only person in my area with 14 x 12's doesn't take a honey crop. I know that Peter Hewitt used to build colony's up on double brood and shake the bees down into 1 box for the heather harvest. It's my associations AGM tonight so I'll be bending a few ears to answer a few of my questions.

 

[mikethebee]

'tilt and look' its that easy otherwise you have to look through all the frames in every hive 20 hive 1 B/box Apiarie = 220 frames "time consuming"
tilt the top brood box and look in between the frames for queen cells if you see cells then you have to go though every frame cutting out cells in that box

 

[Onge]

I suppose you could say double shallow = Standard Deep, as well, but I don't know of anyone who ever does that for brood.

I will be running multiple medium poly Langstroth super boxes throughout.

At the beginning of next season.

Ill let you know how I get on.

 

[GingerNut]

I shall be using 14x12 in 5 hives next year.

Yours Roy

 

[MJBee]

I run 6 colonies on single commercial boxes but have 2 that are on double national brood boxes. By feeding hard in the spring I can build these two quickly to the point where I can pile 3 supers on each. Then by putting the queen in the bottom brood I can move the other brood to the top, above the supers, and use it for queen cell raising. This avoids having to make the colony queenless.
Mike

 

[Haughton Honey]

I run 6 colonies on single commercial boxes but have 2 that are on double national brood boxes. By feeding hard in the spring I can build these two quickly to the point where I can pile 3 supers on each. Then by putting the queen in the bottom brood I can move the other brood to the top, above the supers, and use it for queen cell raising. This avoids having to make the colony queenless.
Mike

That's very interesting Mike. It appears to be a little like the traditional Demaree method of artificial swarming, is it not? Do you eventually place a floor beneath the 'upper' brood box to create a second colony or do you just harvest Q cells and transfer them to nuc boxes in order to raise several?

 

[Somerford]

Does "....Only During Summer Months, If Required" not work for you Somerford? Are you saying that you occasionally use them in the winter?!

nope - occasionally, every other year for increase, and then sometimes all year, sometimes only summer !!