Bee stings

[tonybloke]

Hi TC,

yes you are most welcome, are you able to send me £55 including postage i will send you a pair. Please dont forget to add your contact details for postage.

If your gloves are that bad then i think a new pair would be a great idea. Anything else I can help with please let me know.

if your gloves are totally sting proof, do you not occasionally squash bees whilst inspecting frames of bees? ( I wear nitrile gloves, enabling me to feel if a bee has got between my hand and the frame, and release her before I squash her)

 

[pandtpoultry]

Sorry TC but eh? you said yours were full of stings i did not say yours were new or old I did however say that it would be a good idea if you got a new pair on the basis you say stings are getting through yours. If that is the case i do think it is a good idea you get another new pair. I have had mine 18 months and never had a sting through them. If i can help you I would be glad to help you find a pair where stings do not get through. I am under no circumstances suggesting any age range of your equipment I am meerley trying to help you get a pair like mine as you asked or did i misunderstand your post?

 

[pandtpoultry]

Hi Tonybloke,

I am afraid i do squash the occasional bee but i have severe reactions to bee stings, wasp stings, knat bites, horsefly bites etc.
I personally have had to weigh up the risks to me and that to the bees.
I have decided that protecting myself is my highest priority and for that I wear very thick gloves and yes i lose a few bees because of this is my balanced choice to ensure I can keep bees.
If i were to be stung on a regular basis i would have to get rid off all my bees so i make sure i am 99.9999% as safe as possible so my bees and I get on as well as possible.
I love my bees and keeping them very much and i will continue to preach safety. I accept if i fail to follow my full kit up i might get stung so i make sure i get the best kit and use it properly and even though i boil when i am well protected under my full suit. It is a huge amount of work to keep safe for me but if i want bees then i have to do it. If I had to get stung before I got my bees I WOULD NEVER have got them but i did not and as time goes on I learn how to become safer each time and i love beekeeping.
Getting people stung to see if they want to keep bees is wrong plain and simple why scare them off there are other ways wether this forum agrees or not.
If you get stung in your daily bee business that is your call but there are other ways but the cost of pain free bees is more kit and slower working. For a few hives this is fine for me.
I testify there are other ways. I love the advice on this forum to a degree but getting stung is just plain wrong, i understand it might happen but i really as a new beek look at it from a totally different way.
The fact is i look like the mitchelin man when i go to my hives but i have over wintered 3 very healthy hives and I look after my bees the best i can and in doing so i look after myself to a seriously protected level.
This includes thick gloves which costs a few bees but i have learnt to work with them to minimise that.

 

[Dewin Dwl]

I'm with pantpoultry. In my first year I got the occassional sting, no big deal. Last year I worked with a couple of swarms, made increase etc. This involved an occassional sting. Mid May I'm doing the weekly check, get stung through my glove (at the wrist where there is least layering) and off we go: opening stages of anaphylaxis - itchy palms & feet, getting hot and distressed breathing. Two antihitstamine tablets (double the dose) and a long wait for the ambulance saw me having sweated out some 3litres of water. A long 36hrs in hospital being observed very closely with adrenaline and drips etc.

Like P&T I now dress very cautiously. I would say that I have a minimum of 5mm thickness of clothing layers to stop stings reaching my skin.

The gloves are the weak-link. Leather with nitriles over them seems to be the current best combination for me. You can always hear a bee beginning to get squashed (higher pitch) so squashing them can be avoided. The bees don't seem to be able to grip the nitrile to get the sting mechanism engaged (go read about how it works, its not a hypodermic!). I may go down to double nitriles (like bee inspectors seem to all use without adverse effect) if my observations show no stinging at all.

I got stung a couple more times (not working the bees but I did have a hive of super-aggressive ones with a really huge defensive radius) during last year and can honestly say, if you own an epipen don't be scared of using it! Be ready for "the wild ride" though not as dramatic without. (On a personal aside I think my last reaction suggested some de-sensitisation was kicking in.....oh I do hope so)

This year I am the proud owner of an epipen and quilting the hood on an excellent make of beesuit to give me the defensive thickness. Preparation is everything!

I reckon I'm a good example of how getting a sting as a beginner would show nothing other than stings are sore. In other words, pointless.

p.s. P&T what make of glove are you using?

 

[pandtpoultry]

Hi DD,

I cant find the make of gloves on them sorry but i will add a link of where to get them when my wife gets back from hols as she got them for me. I also use the rubber gloves from many suppliers that stings do not get through but my main ones are ones we used to use in the bakery when we dipped the baking trays in the caustic vat taking off all the burnt off carbon. They are very strong and almost indestructable and trust me no bee can sting through them not cheap but well worth paying in my case and despite their thickness that are more tactile than you might think.

 

[The Cumbrian]

full of stings

Not full I said I can be stung through them. Not quite the same thing.

never had a sting through them.

The your bees are either not as strong as mine or have shorter stings

did i misunderstand your post?

I think you may have partly mistaken my post. I am quite happy with my equipment but I can (and do very occasionally ) get stung through them. Also I am not alone I do know others who do.

What I was trying to do was to suggest, gently, that a totally bomb proof set of protection which will work comfortably in hot weather and still give a reasonable degree of "feel" through gloves - may not be totally possible.

Incidentally no offence taken or intended.

 

[pandtpoultry]

Hi TC,

I take no offence or attempt to pass on either. I understand you can get stung but if we strip this right back i am saying in my view you dont have to get stung and telling a new bee to go and get stung is barbaric.
New keepers should of course be informed very clearley of the risks but there should be more encouragment and emphasis on safety than get stung, lets go the other way lets tell them to try not to get stung at almost all costs and encourage more people into bee keeping.
People should be encouraged into this and inflicting pain is not encouragement it is just plain wrong and dangerous. I understand if you are commercial with lots of hives the 'bombproof' system may not work for you but how many new beeks go straight for 20-200 hives? I understand my 'bombproof' method is slow and hot but come on guys a new bee has 1-3 hive as a start how hard is it really to get safely kitted? So i take 5-10 minutes longer than you to inspect a hive what does it matter if i dont get stung and the weather permits and on a nice day i really enjoy those extra minutes .
Encouraging people to get stung is just wrong, encouraging people to take up the hobby and be extra safe is just right.
BEE safe and sting free is possible and should be encouraged, it takes more time and maybe a few more £'s and is correct, because people have been stung and will be stung do not make encouraging people to get stung correct.

 

[Stiffy]

Bees are not cuddly little animals and can and have killed

Although I dont advocate new bee keepers being forced into a bee sting initiation they should be made aware that what ever they do they will be stung at some point.
Also, they will if they keep bees long enough encounter a nasty colony they will have to either deal with or get someone else to.
An ill tempered colony of bees is not an easy thing to deal with and from personal experience they will find any 'chinks' in your preparations.

I would therefore recommend that a new bee keepers handles a few hives before getting their own.
With all that said, they are still fantastic
Cheers
S

 

[pandtpoultry]

yes handling is great and newbee more hands on the better but that is different to getting stung on purpose.

 

[itma]

... i have severe reactions to bee stings, wasp stings, knat bites, horsefly bites etc.
I personally have had to weigh up the risks to me and that to the bees.
...
If i were to be stung on a regular basis i would have to get rid off all my bees so i make sure i am 99.9999% as safe as possible so my bees and I get on as well as possible.
... It is a huge amount of work to keep safe for me but if i want bees then i have to do it.
... I look after my bees the best i can and in doing so i look after myself to a seriously protected level.
This includes thick gloves which costs a few bees but i have learnt to work with them to minimise that.

Without comment on your thick gloves, I would suggest that you investigate NHS desensitisation therapy possibilities.
There are various notes and comments on the forum from those who have benefited from the injections.

If your reactions are "severe", then you should investigate this option. My stings have been largely 1/ from other people's bees when visiting them and 2/ while chatting afterwards, unprotected, at a notionally 'safe' distance ... and however thick my gloves, it would have made no difference.

 

[Poly Hive]

I am going to disagree here.

Getting new beekeepers stung is not at all barbaric as they need to find out BEFORE investing possibly hundreds of pounds that they are "comfortable" with being stung, that they do not suffer a nasty reaction and that they are again "comfortable" in the midst of thousands of insects. It's not everyone's comfort zone.

Far better to find out right at the off that the craft is not for pursuing rather than later. I can think of at least one forum member last year who had to give up.

PH

 

[BBG]

Live dangerously and lose some money if it doesn't work out or wear heavy gear

 

[pandtpoultry]

Thanks Itma I will look into this.
PH I understand what you are tying to say but it is still bonkers. Now you are worried about a few quid of others money, ok a couple of hundred pounds but how is that a serious argument?
On your method i would have saved loads of money because I would not be keeping bees now (but to be honest i would just walk away from you thinking that today they let you out of a straight jacket for the day on such a suggestion and thank you kindly for your time)
How many other bee keepers do we lose with this method?
I hate the idea of being stung, i know it hurts and I know i will lose a week of work if i get stung - will i stop keeping bees - no way!
I look at the situation as I said above differently I go as sting proof as possible to enjoy my hobby rather than live in fear or give up.
I see your hard work on this site and thankyou for some info i have followed but on this one i feel very sad for those whom follow this advice and I am sure beekeeping overall will be the loser - such a real shame but I will try to make my views appear to ensure new guys get another idea from a new beekeeper that would not consider such a mad suggestion........

 

[Drinkstone]

After the discussion

The decision! Well little did I know such a question would spark such comments, lively and widely different and all useful. Thanks to all who have commented. Not sure if I would go ahead if I knew I would have a week off work as a result of every sting, that's one committed to his bee's and commendable. Taking all into consideration the bee's are arriving on 5th April..........why? Because I have wanted to keep bees since I did a retired Colonel's garden and he told me not to cut the grass round the beehives! I said too late I have. Why are you not stung he said! I told the old boy I had told the bees it was ok.......he said keep bees. That is 30 years ago!
I am retired (ish) so a week off work is fine, I have always Been a bit mad and finally we need the bees do we not?
Oh yeah NAND I will enjoy it. Thanks again for all the advice and information.

 

[pandtpoultry]

enjoy them

 

[tonybloke]

I am going to disagree here.

Getting new beekeepers stung is not at all barbaric as they need to find out BEFORE investing possibly hundreds of pounds that they are "comfortable" with being stung, that they do not suffer a nasty reaction and that they are again "comfortable" in the midst of thousands of insects. It's not everyone's comfort zone.

Far better to find out right at the off that the craft is not for pursuing rather than later.
PH

it's always a good idea to make sure that bees are 'for you' before investing in bees and equipment. I had my mate come round and be beside me while I opened up and inspected a huge ( commercial with 4 supers ) colony to make sure he was fine with several thousand bees before he started in the craft / hobby. he also got stung ( on the end of the nose! ) but this was after we'd un-suited and were having a cuppa, and was NOT planned.