Bee stings

[small_newworld]

Wasp sting venom and bee sting venom involve different chemicials- usally if you react to one you wont react to the other. Adding vinegar or bicarb to the sting site will only affect the local area- the venom will have likely been injected below the skin level and enter the blood stream fairly quickly; this is the time to watch for a more systemic reaction (wheezing, streaming nose, tightness of chest, closing of throat etc.), if you have this type of reation (in particular tightening chest or airway closing) then 999 is a wise precaution.

Might i suggest not going out to deliberalty get stung- it sounds a bit silly; far better perhaps to have someone accompany you while you visit and inspect a friends or association apiary over a bit of time. Then if you get stung there will be someone to assist you should you have serious reaction straight away. Remeber that systemic and allergic reactions can occur hours after being stung. So take it easy the first few times of being stung.

Carry antihistimines always anyway incase someone around gets stung to. I have a theory that tough skin like on the fingers prevents the sting going as deep so generally less of a reaction occurs- if you get stung near the eye on soft weak skin then it blows up like a hot air balloon on a summers evening because the venom can penetrate much futher into the tissue.

Hope it helps and dont worry- very severe reactions seem rare and a lot of histeria can be whipped up by talk of 'reactions'.

 

[pandtpoultry]

Ok I am still a new beekeeper but is getting stung madness?? Should we not be telling them how to protect themselves better.

Why do you have to get stung, if well protected you should be fine.

My advice is to enjoy bees dont find if you are allergic just dress well and PROTECT yourself.

I wrapped up well since getting bees but last season I made a mistake and got nobbled on the ankle late in the season and I was out of action for 7 days.

Now I have an even better routine and i am mega cautious but still love my bees and my weak spot is well covered and my wife checks my suit upon my return fully for stray bees before i take it off.

So my advice the best way to get stung is DO NOT GET STUNG experienced beeks do not react from some stings as I understand then a week later they can be in a right mess from a sting - so getting stung in my minds eye is just silly.......... but that is just me.

 

[Jeff Buzz]

So next time I get stung by a wasp i will get one of my bees to sting me in the same place ...brilliant idea like pouring white wine on red wine spills to stop the staining

Ha so wasps have a alkaline sting and bees have an acid sting, one neutralizes the other

 

[tkwinston4]

 

[Teemore]

Moggs and FreeFall,

Whilst I am not advocating the practice it is by no means daft.

A beekeeping acquaintance has just benefitted from a gift of several commercial hives and a lot of supers from a person who discovered they did not like bees flying closely around them and that they disliked being stung. They only discovered this when they went to collect their Nuc of bees last summer. Had they made this discovery in a controlled environment they might not have splashed out on the hives and supers. Had they been introduced to bees in a controlled environment with the support of other beekeepers they might even have overcome their dislike of bees flying around them.

As for getting stung by a bee, it is no worse than getting stung by a nettle and those I pull up with my bare hands when working in the garden etc. I know that some folk unfortunately react more strongly to bee stings and for those people, would it not be better to find out that they do not like being stung before investing heavily in the hobby?

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

Sometimes I wonder at the words of 'wisdom' here. To advise a would-be beekeeper to go and get stung is imho, plainly daft. Why deliberately detract from the pleasure of having bees buzzing around, in a situation populated by (now extremely nervous) novices, only to have the novice remember the very first encounter with bees as a painful one.

Really? If I was one of the unlucky 2% that have a major allergy I'd much rather know about it in a controlled environment before I got my bees. Similarly if I found bee stings unbearably painful I would also rather know as it would help me decide if the risk was worth it.

And I totally fail to see why the novice, now aware about the sting sensation and suitably protected, would whimper around the hive not getting enjoyment.

Each to his own I guess.

 

[pandtpoultry]

I agree with Moggs.

Controlled enviroment? How strange is that? I sell electric netting for poultry - should people test wether it is on with their hands of course not I should tell them how to test it and use it safely - or should i shock them in a safe enviroment?

I dont eat off of a knife because I was taught it was not safe.... this could go on but the principle is simple.

What is the controlled enviroment? Are there professional doctors and medical staff at these controlled enviroments?

The best controlled enviroment it training in safety therefore control your own enviroment.

 

[Swarm]

Sometimes I wonder at the words of 'wisdom' here. To advise a would-be beekeeper to go and get stung is imho, plainly daft. Why deliberately detract from the pleasure of having bees buzzing around, in a situation populated by (now extremely nervous) novices, only to have the novice remember the very first encounter with bees as a painful one. Not only that, but to deliberately agitate the colony with sting pheromone. The suggestion that such a measure might indicate reaction or no reaction is unfounded too as the reaction can change, sting for sting.

So very well said.
Talking with a Bee Inspector about the subject, I remember him saying that the best idea was to try not to be stung as it introduces toxins and sooner or later there may be a time when the body will react badly and anyway, pain is pain afterall. If you are working near the hive, veil up.

Last season I was stung twice while removing supers. First was my fault (obviously both were my fault) as I was rushing to get them off before it rained and had not zipped up my veil fully. There were a fair amount that had not cleared and yes, there was that buzzing that sounded closer than usual. I retired and tried to flip my veil, at the same time knowing what was coming. Sting to the top of my head. Cursing my stupidity, I returned to finish off and by this time had that hot feeling at the sting site. I bagged up the super and felt a sharp pain on the inside of my upper arm, this one was through the suit and removed promptly. Over the following days the slight swelling on my head subsided and there was hardly any discomfort. My arm was a different matter as the swelling spread from a small patch on my bicep, all the way to my wrist. It throbbed and itched and the pain was enough to wake me at night. It took just over a week to go and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

 

[Moggs]

M.A. as you say, each to his own. That would be your choice, with perfect reasoning. However, it's a different situation to find respected (and one would hope, experienced), beekeepers advocating such an unknown on the unknowing. And then what would the mentor do, when presented with an extreme reaction (albeit unlikely)?

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

I agree with Moggs.

Controlled enviroment? How strange is that? I sell electric netting for poultry - should people test wether it is on with their hands of course not I should tell them how to test it and use it safely - or should i shock them in a safe enviroment?

Do your customers expect to be regularly shocked with electric netting? If so, and they knew it could kill them or have a debilitating effect does that affect the wisdom of buying it?

I dont eat off of a knife because I was taught it was not safe.... this could go on but the principle is simple.
Sorry to be rude but that's a bloody stupid analogy.

What is the controlled enviroment? Are there professional doctors and medical staff at these controlled enviroments?I dont feel inclined to help with the joined up thinking on this, if you cant figure it out for yourself then probably not worth the bother, leave it to Darwin.

The best controlled enviroment it training in safety therefore control your own enviroment.
Sorry, has anyone said that knowledge of protection should be ignored?

So very well said.
Talking with a Bee Inspector about the subject, I remember him saying that the best idea was to try not to be stung as it introduces toxins and sooner or later there may be a time when the body will react badly and anyway, pain is pain afterall. If you are working near the hive, veil up.

Valid point but personally I'd rather know beforehand. Disagree that "pain is pain" - stings affect different people to wildly differing degrees, and pain tolerance is also not a constant.

Last season I was stung twice while removing supers. .... It took just over a week to go and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

So, if it is so unpleasant then you would agree that some, armed with this knowledge, would rather not be beekeepers? I'd have thought it better to find out before you spend thousands.

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

M.A. as you say, each to his own. That would be your choice, with perfect reasoning. However, it's a different situation to find respected (and one would hope, experienced), beekeepers advocating such an unknown on the unknowing. And then what would the mentor do, when presented with an extreme reaction (albeit unlikely)?

OK, my last reply on this subject (promise!)

In the situation you describe, the mentor would be armed with,at the very least, a mobile phone and have a clear plan in his head what to do in worst case. I'm not suggesting this is the best way of finding out, but it is better than not knowing.

 

[pandtpoultry]

MA you shoot me down so easily but you are one whoms proves Darwin is not always correct as you are still here.

Why should people get stung regularly? You ask if people will get electric shocks from the netting regularly well yes if they hold it constantly and it will do them damage but if they dont then they will not. Does this mean we will all get stung regularly? No because rather than saying something stupid like get stung to test - try protect against to be safe.

The knife comment was of course stupid but just as daft as telling others to get stung and worst case someone has a mobile phone - trully stupid. See how you get on in court for that one if there is a serious reaction.

You say you are not discounting protection but by not discussing it with new-bees then you are exactly doing that! jabbering on about test stings but a huge great void on protection and safety is massivly discounting protection.

 

[Swarm]

Let's not get carried away ppl, it's only opinion afterall.

MA,
I was trying to explain how sting reactions can vary, maybe not that well, so apologies. My point being that with such variation, a test sting may/probably will prove nothing, whereas a subsequent sting could be something totally different.

 

[Moggs]

PandPT - I think that was uncalled for. No need to get nasty when engaged in a little healthy debate!

 

[pandtpoultry]

Moggs - Dont think I got nasty just replied in same vane as eariler reply to me.

I think asking people to sting themselves is stupid. If anyone is offended I can not apologise as it is plain daft and infact very unsafe a procedure.

 

[itma]

To advise a would-be beekeeper to go and get stung is imho, plainly daft.

Really? If I was one of the unlucky 2% that have a major allergy I'd much rather know about it in a controlled environment before I got my bees. Similarly if I found bee stings unbearably painful I would also rather know as it would help me decide if the risk was worth it.
...

I don't think the instruction to get stung before getting bees should be taken TOO seriously.

Good thing to handle bees before committing to getting your own.
Handle bees and eventually you will be stung.
But its not a licensing requirement.

If anyone has any reason to suspect that they may react badly to bee-stings, I'm sure that a GP would arrange for an allergy-sensitivity "RAST" test. (Maybe not free if you haven't had a sting, let alone a bad reaction - but ask!)
Beestings for most people are subjectively similar to wasp stings - at the time of stinging. Though I have the impression that non-instant response may be greater with beestings. A 'follower' got me (unveiled) on the cheek, and that night I had something like toothache in that area, but minimal swelling - perhaps thanks to the Piriton. But I've not had any other late-responses to other beestings.

And it is worth pointing out to newcomers that it is possible to get an NHS course of injections to de-sensitise you to beesting toxins, should you have a problem beyond the usual stinging sensation.
Oh, and a very few people do build up a sensitivity to beestings, with a greater reaction each time ... though for most folk the opposite applies, and they build up a tolerance.

If you are fussed, get a test.
No need to go round deliberately trying to get stung. Sooner or later, it'll happen!

 

[Poly Hive]

Me thinks getting a NHS test might be more difficult than some think.

Getting stung pre taking up the hobby is in my wee thoughts a very good idea, and one that has been around a long time.

The reaction from one sting to the next does vary and that variation can be big.

Just awkward things to be considered.

PH

 

[The Cumbrian]

Why do you have to get stung, if well protected you should be fine.

Can I have a pair of gloves like yours please? My leather ones have had stings through them!

 

[pandtpoultry]

Hi TC,

yes you are most welcome, are you able to send me £55 including postage i will send you a pair. Please dont forget to add your contact details for postage.

If your gloves are that bad then i think a new pair would be a great idea. Anything else I can help with please let me know.

 

[The Cumbrian]

Hi TC,

a new pair would be a great idea.

Who said they aren't new?