Adding a super in early march?

[JohnRoss]

It hit 14 deg in the sheltered sun here yesterday so I took the opportunity to have a look under some crown boards. It was a useful exercise. I found that one of my queens were laying drones so I shook them out, I also found that two of my colonies were full of bees.

One in Particular was bursting, Brood in 10 frames in the top box and judging by numbers probably in the lower box too. (they are on double brood). In the past I have lost very strong colonies to starvation in march, my solution was to add a queen excluder and a super with nothing in the middle frames but four of the outer frames are full of honey that has mostly christallised. (form a super that I was rather late removing last year) My thinking is that is there is good weather and some dandelion/ spring flowers, they are strong enough to fill in some honey but if there is poor weather I have given them extra stores. A quick glance under the lid at the middle frames should tell me if stores are going up or down.

 

[thenovice]

odd way of doing things... having double brood this early would be fortunate. the natural way for the bees is to start up top where it is nice and warm and move downwards as stores grow. most likely the bottom box is empty (check!) putting a super with QE on top is adding a lot of empty space they need to warm up exacerbating the issue of burning stores. I would go with the weather. if it is nice and flowers are in bloom, not to worry. If the weather turns for the worst, check stores and give syrup if needed. Alternatively, put the super under the brood boxes?

 

[oliver90owner]

You add a super when necessary, nothing to do with February, March or April. No point in adding space unless they have forage. Still mostly pollen going in, I would suspect. But the beekeeper should be watching the local conditions. March 1st is very different to March 31st.

With large colonies the starvation is usually down to zero stores? So the issue is not one of 'adding supers', but of maintaining stores levels by feeding. Perhaps a too subtle difference for some?

 

[Finman]

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First new boxes shall be added because colony starts to grow. IT takes its own time that the colony can store surplus into super.

Empty super above brood only sucks the heat from brood.

.

 

[Plenty of honey]

It hit 14 deg in the sheltered sun here yesterday so I took the opportunity to have a look under some crown boards. It was a useful exercise. I found that one of my queens were laying drones so I shook them out, I also found that two of my colonies were full of bees.

One in Particular was bursting, Brood in 10 frames in the top box and judging by numbers probably in the lower box too. (they are on double brood). In the past I have lost very strong colonies to starvation in march, my solution was to add a queen excluder and a super with nothing in the middle frames but four of the outer frames are full of honey that has mostly christallised. (form a super that I was rather late removing last year) My thinking is that is there is good weather and some dandelion/ spring flowers, they are strong enough to fill in some honey but if there is poor weather I have given them extra stores. A quick glance under the lid at the middle frames should tell me if stores are going up or down.

I would say remove some of the brood and distribute to weaker colonies. Use the brood as a "bee bomb"
Its called Equalising. Use that very strong colony to boost a couple of others. Stops you having to worry about it swarming early. dont mess around with supers this time of year. Thats really a mid April thing, when you can do it all at the same time.
Brother Adams did this until he was happy all of his hives were up at the same strength. Its also a very logical thing to do!

 

[B+.]

You add a super when necessary, nothing to do with February, March or April. No point in adding space unless they have forage. Still mostly pollen going in, I would suspect. But the beekeeper should be watching the local conditions. March 1st is very different to March 31st.

My bees were completely covered in yellow pollen yesterday. A little fresh nectar but not a lot.
I did add an extra deep to a couple that were only in singles but this was below the current brood box. It gives extra space for that pollen to be stored and the queen to expand her brood nest (downwards).

 

[B+.]

Its called Equalising

I wonder how you identify which queens are producing the biggest colonies (and may be the best to raise daughters from) if you constantly stealing her brood? Some colonies develop later and some develop sooner. This is important information. I don't equalise my test colonies. I may steal a frame or two of bees/brood from my other colonies to form a nucleus, but not for another couple of months yet

 

[Heather]

My dilemma.. in China for a while , and colonies here are growing fast.
Half of them can safely accommodate a super to allow bee growth safely for the next 3 weeks, but the others are fine (9 seams)... at the moment. but - 3 weeks in beekeeping can see a rapid change within the hive.
I have decided (looking at the forecast in the SE) to stick a super on each one... if some have excessive room for a while so be it.

 

[Plenty of honey]

I wonder how you identify which queens are producing the biggest colonies (and may be the best to raise daughters from) if you constantly stealing her brood? Some colonies develop later and some develop sooner. This is important information. I don't equalise my test colonies. I may steal a frame or two of bees/brood from my other colonies to form a nucleus, but not for another couple of months yet

I dont remove anything yet and wont be doing any equalising up probably until first or second week of April. Also i have some queens overwintering in my home yard, so if i can, I make a really early nuc up from three colonies, then give it a mated queen. Its a luxury but easy when you have a few strong colonies. However i see your point!
Re recording and notes: If i take a frame of brood from any hive i write it on the roof. Then i know which colonies have given me what and when.
For breeder queen selection this recording helps identify the better queens, but as you well know, its more than one quality were looking for.
Just to say also, that i am a queen rearer, not a queen breeder. Although a little defeatist, i do tend to rely on buying in a couple of good queens every year, see how they perform and consider using them for grafting from the year after. I am on my own and reality is the key, i cant spend a lot of time selecting stock, recording everything and draw on the information later on. Perhaps when if i have more time later, after i am up to my numbers, apiaries and equipment, then i would certainly like to concentrate on better stock selection and breeding.
I still think that Mike Palmers quote rules!
"you can raise a few good queens, from less than ideal stock, under ideal conditions as opposed trying to raise good queens from proven stock under less than ideal conditions."

perhaps sorry!

 

[Finman]

My dilemma.. in China for a while , and colonies here are growing fast.
Half of them can safely accommodate a super to allow bee growth safely for the next 3 weeks, but the others are fine (9 seams)... at the moment. but - 3 weeks in beekeeping can see a rapid change within the hive.
I have decided (looking at the forecast in the SE) to stick a super on each one... if some have excessive room for a while so be it.

Heather, you old fart. This is not your first spring when hives grow. You surely know what to do.
.

 

[Anduril]

Heather, you old fart. This is not your first spring when hives grow. You surely know what to do.
.

My dilemma.. in China for a while , and colonies here are growing fast.
Half of them can safely accommodate a super to allow bee growth safely for the next 3 weeks, but the others are fine (9 seams)... at the moment. but - 3 weeks in beekeeping can see a rapid change within the hive.
I have decided (looking at the forecast in the SE) to stick a super on each one... if some have excessive room for a while so be it.

Look where Heather if Finny!

 

[Beefriendly]

Brother Adams did this until he was happy all of his hives were up at the same strength. Its also a very logical thing to do!

Not sure Br. Adam had early spring crops of oil seed rape to get bees ready to forage on. If he had, he may have changed his spring management.
I prefer a few very strong hives this time of year to several weaker ones. I guess I do the opposite of equalizing.

 

[Eyeman]

I prefer a few very strong hives this time of year to several weaker ones. I guess I do the opposite of equalizing.

Have you considered overwintering some nucs? Mine overwinter in pairs.
My double height nucs buildup quicker than the equivalent single brood box probably because the top nucs' 5 brood frames are warmed by the lower nuc. They usually need splitting several weeks before my main colonies. The brood from the nucs can be used to maximize the strength of you main colonies.
I keep 1 double height nuc per main colony.

 

[Beefriendly]

Have you considered overwintering some nucs? Mine overwinter in pairs.

Yes, they get plundered mercilessly.

 

[bjosephd]

I have a single lang that is pretty damn full of bees on top bars of all 10 frames but am reluctant to either go through it or lift it entirely to put a new BB underneath. It would be a foundation less box, so it would probably rather slow them down at least, but then without regular inspections, carnage could ensue! Also, without drawn comb I doubt it's a great time for them to draw new comb, although they are building up brace comb between top bars and polycarbonate crown board.

My fear of queen damage on inspection or box lifting is ever-present. Not a good time to damage such a prolific young queen, but then she needs the space!? 12oC no wind and cloudy tomorrow... might be a possible moment.

 

[Finman]

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If you want them swarm, do not add a box.
.

 

[bjosephd]

.
If you want them swarm, do not add a box.
.

I would rather they didn't...

 

[Heather]

Finman!!!... fart probably!.. old ?? ****off - just cos my birthday today and a year older...
Most hives well up to strength and little room for more stores. I don't want to come back to problems.

 

[bjosephd]

Finman!!!... fart probably!.. old ?? ****off - just cos my birthday today and a year older...
Most hives well up to strength and little room for more stores. I don't want to come back to problems.

IS it actually your birthday today? What are the chances! Happy birthday... is also my sister's birthday!

 

[Finman]

Finman!!!... fart probably!.. old ?? ****off - just cos my birthday today and a year older...
Most hives well up to strength and little room for more stores. I don't want to come back to problems.

I had birth day 13.3, yesterday. I am 70 y.

Like Germans say, a human is alive as long he farts.