Winter ventilation and mouse guards

[Chris Nother]

Hi folks, with open mesh floors, how critical is it to have the full entrance block removed for the winter - do they provide too much ventilation along with the OMF? on the other hand, I have a Paynes national with integrated mouse guard of only four holes in the supplied entrance block - along with off (even with tray in underneath) - is this enough ventilation for the winter or should I remove the entrance block altogether and fit a mouse guard across the front? I have a Lyson poly national that has a nice integrated 10 slot mouse guard that means the entrance is one third available for air circulation which seems right. The just need to decide what to do with the two cedar nationals! Future hive purchase are going to be the Lyson nationals as designed for Donegal Bees - definitely a huge amount of thought behind the design!!

 

[Arfermo]

Hi folks, with open mesh floors, how critical is it to have the full entrance block removed for the winter - do they provide too much ventilation along with the OMF? on the other hand, I have a Paynes national with integrated mouse guard of only four holes in the supplied entrance block - along with off (even with tray in underneath) - is this enough ventilation for the winter or should I remove the entrance block altogether and fit a mouse guard across the front? I have a Lyson poly national that has a nice integrated 10 slot mouse guard that means the entrance is one third available for air circulation which seems right. The just need to decide what to do with the two cedar nationals! Future hive purchase are going to be the Lyson nationals as designed for Donegal Bees - definitely a huge amount of thought behind the design!!

Not critical and have never done it. Nor have I ever had to bother with mouse guards. On a high enough stand with an overhang the mice here don't seem to have climbing tackle or ladders. With an open mesh floor no further ventilation needed as air will circulate around the cluster well enough.

 

[MuswellMetro]

on solid floors it was necessary with an uninsulated solid floor hive to tip the hive forward and remove the entrance block if following the vented crown board1940s method ,,Hence this let mice in, so you added a mouseguard, The 35cm square mesh on OMF if left open total changes why you need a mouse because the open OMF is more than adequate and i just reduce a 9mm entrance block with top insulation. However some OMF have very open backs and i add a piece of correx as draught excluder

 

[Chris Nother]

Thanks for that folks!

 

[bobthecob]

You don't leave your OMF inspection tray in over winter though, right? Wasn't clear from the wording. Sorry for my confusion.

Re ventilation - agree with above. If you have an OMF the entrance is pretty irrelevant from the point of view of ventilation, so I keep entrance blocks in all the time.

 

[Niv]

I leave the entrance block in but put a mouse guard over.

However - just to throw another factor in. When I told this to a fellow beekeeper who said that they take the block out and put a full length mouse guard on to help the bees with 'dead bee' management for want of a better word. Basically if you have a small entrance there is a risk that it gets blocked with dead bees and the mouse guard acts as something to get dead bees trapped on etc. - Any thoughts on that? Not had an issue myself so wondering if its a bit of the old wifes tale type thing.

 

[Chris Nother]

You don't leave your OMF inspection tray in over winter though, right? Wasn't clear from the wording. Sorry for my confusion.

Re ventilation - agree with above. If you have an OMF the entrance is pretty irrelevant from the point of view of ventilation, so I keep entrance blocks in all the time.

I was going to leave the inspection tray in - it doesn't seal the OMF off fully really - but now you have me thinking!

 

[Speybee]

I leave the entrance block in but put a mouse guard over.

However - just to throw another factor in. When I told this to a fellow beekeeper who said that they take the block out and put a full length mouse guard on to help the bees with 'dead bee' management for want of a better word. Basically if you have a small entrance there is a risk that it gets blocked with dead bees and the mouse guard acts as something to get dead bees trapped on etc. - Any thoughts on that? Not had an issue myself so wondering if its a bit of the old wifes tale type thing.

My experience has been on the National with metal mouse guard that dead bees can build up as the Mortuary bees need more space to carry out their dead.
I solve this by every so often if it is one of those clear dry days to quickly sweep away the dead bees from the entrance using the bee brush after I take off the guard.
After an hour or so I will replace the metal guard back against the entrance, by using drawing pin at each end to keep it fixed on.

The wbc is easier I just move the slats along.

 

[madasafish]

I have seen a hive with mouseguard TOTALLY blocked with dead bees in winter...

I run a mix of OMF and solid floors.

Varroa boards in all winter, entrance width reduced. No mouseguards. All hives on stands 20-30cm off ground...

Never seen mice in hives... seen them under them and in greenhouse/garage etc..(edge of fields and woods.)

 

[The Poot in Somerset]

I’m on Nationals with OMFs and leave varroa boards in all winter, entrance blocks out, full length mouse guard in place. The bees have ventilation through the full length entrance and a gap at the rear of the hive above the varroa tray. I mostly use a box beneath the brood chamber to reduce droughts / strong winds.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

underfloor entrances -wasps hate them , open full length all year,no need for mouseguards, easier for the mortuary bees as they can just drop the dead out the entrance,

 

[bobthecob]

I was going to leave the inspection tray in - it doesn't seal the OMF off fully really - but now you have me thinking!

Fair enough - I don't, but maybe I should. I have poly hives though, so I think I should leave the tray out.

 

[Curly green finger's]

I have seen a hive with mouseguard TOTALLY blocked with dead bees in winter...

I run a mix of OMF and solid floors.

Varroa boards in all winter, entrance width reduced. No mouseguards. All hives on stands 20-30cm off ground...

Never seen mice in hives... seen them under them and in greenhouse/garage etc..(edge of fields and woods.)

My views, I don't like mouse guards and i don't use them.

Reasons..
1. Early spring pollen can get knocked of while trying to get through the holes.
When they do toilet duties over the winter/spring there restrictive.
Winter bees get stuck in the mouse guards.

I have my inspection boards in all winter and some colonys have a super nadired under the floor as a wind break
Entrances are 50mmx8mm some are 25mmx9mm.
Hives are elivated more of the ground for winter, 45cm min.
When nadiring a super under the floor it helps to lift the hive of the ground.

I've not had mouse/shrew problems since I've been beeking!
And I've not lost a colony either.


Most of my colonys are 450m+ above sea level on a windy hill side.
What works for me, might not work for a beekeeper in the valley.

I've been planing to make some underfloor entrances.. Must get and do it this winter.

 

[Hachi]

I use mouse guards as where my bees are if mice get in they don't just curl up in the corner they trash your frames and drag a load of nesting crap in.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Never had a mouse get into any of my hives. OMF floors, permanent reduced entrances (9 x 80), sitting on breeze block stands with an overhang. Some years ago I had a block in front of a stand as a draught break and a mouse used it to try to gain access. I found the mouse painfully trying to creep away after a serious bit of defence by the guard bees then it keeled over and expired.

 

[GuyNir]

No mouse guards. Polys with OMF’s. Reduced entrance kept in all year (Paynes plastic reducer) & boards in. Wind is my biggest issue. Never had a mouse in.

 

[bobthecob]

No mouse guards. Polys with OMF’s. Reduced entrance kept in all year (Paynes plastic reducer) & boards in. Wind is my biggest issue. Never had a mouse in.

Ditto, though I did have one in a Maisemore poly nuc last year. I will be keeping the nuc entrances closed to 2 bee space this year so at least if a mouse pushes its way in I should notice it.

 

[Chris Nother]

underfloor entrances -wasps hate them , open full length all year,no need for mouseguards, easier for the mortuary bees as they can just drop the dead out the entrance,

Underfloor entrance? Not familiar with the term - thanks!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Underfloor entrance? Not familiar with the term - thanks!

https://beekeepingforum.co.uk/threa...-on-the-dartington-underfloor-entrance.46002/

 

[GuyNir]

Ditto, though I did have one in a Maisemore poly nuc last year. I will be keeping the nuc entrances closed to 2 bee space this year so at least if a mouse pushes its way in I should notice it.

Was that on the Maisemore detached nuc floor, or the all in one nuc? (I also have several Maisemore nucs overwintering, all on detached floor nucs)