Who uses the Rose Hive method ?

[BrianO]

Hi

Reading book presently, who here manages their hives to this system, more suitable to warmer climes ?

If you do and switched, from what hive type to this type , Would you recommend it as a method of managing a hive, problems ? Increased honey crop ? Effect on swarming occurrence ? Any other experiences ?

Cheers

Brian

 

[Madge]

Why do you think the Rose hive method is more suitable to warmer climates?

 

[BrianO]

Well, thought ( maybe incorrectly ) that given it is based partly on a larger brood area , it would be more suitable for larger colonies that have an extended season in which to breed, say like in Italy/Spain where they usually can count on good weather in Spring and Autumn ?

 

[Madge]

It's a one-size box system like any other and you can use the hive in any way you like. Specific to the Rose hive is that it is based on a National hive footprint - so the brood area need not be particularly large. Using it without a queen excluder, the bees will create a brood area as big as they need.

 

[Madge]

The advantage of the Rose hive is that the size of the boxes is a convenient compromise between National deeps and National shallows - but I wouldn't want to over-winter my bees in a box with plywood sides.

 

[bontbee]

and a rose osb is heavier than a national super when full of honey (deeper box and 12 frames)...OK if you are built like Garth!

 

[Madge]

Sorry - coming back to your question. The essence of the Rose hive is that it is a one-box size hive. The 'system' is getting the brood area jam-packed with bees and only then inserting a new box in- between the two boxes. I have never tried that. I now have a hive on only National shallows - but I'm not sure that I would ever want to split a brood nest in that manner.

 

[DulwichGnome]

Hi BrianO, I use Rose sized foundationless frames in cut down Swienty Poly box (old pattern)which takes 10 frames. I have for the past two years split the brood and put an empty box in between the brood. However I have found it helps if you move the two middle frames from the lower box into the middle box forming a bridge between the brood, the spare frames from the middle box go on the outside of the lower box. If it's done when there is a flow on then it can be drawn and layed up in no time and there is a flush of workers in 21 days.

Having 2+ boxes of brood makes looking for queen cells very easy as you just lift and tilt the top box. If there is no cells on the bottom of the frames I leave it alone.
To help with inspections when the honey builds up I have two travel boxes on site and remove three or four frames and then lift the box. If the honey boxes are getting too full I remove the capped ones and replace with empty frames. My hives at the height of the season are no more than 6 boxes high.

Hope that helps,
Mike.

PS I also have a hive of wooden shallows on the same system and it worked well. If you want to try it and have half a dozen supers spare it's a good way of getting started.

 

[Madge]

Hi BrianO, I use Rose sized foundationless frames in cut down Swienty Poly box (old pattern)which takes 10 frames. ...

DG - does that leave you with enough dovetail joints for the box to remain sturdy? I suppose you use glue as well?
Kitta

 

[DulwichGnome]

DG - does that leave you with enough dovetail joints for the box to remain sturdy? I suppose you use glue as well?
Kitta

Yes, glued and clamped till dry then cut. Looking at the new design the excess would need to come out of the middle meaning two cuts.

Mike.

 

[Fatbee]

Sorry - coming back to your question. The essence of the Rose hive is that it is a one-box size hive. The 'system' is getting the brood area jam-packed with bees and only then inserting a new box in- between the two boxes. I have never tried that. I now have a hive on only National shallows - but I'm not sure that I would ever want to split a brood nest in that manner.

Interesting having a colony in national supers? Was this by accident or through experimenting?
Any benefits you have found from this?

 

[Madge]

Interesting having a colony in national supers? Was this by accident or through experimenting?
Any benefits you have found from this?

More by accident, Fatbee. I don't use queen excluders, and towards the end of this season the queen had stopped laying and the deep box became empty - so I removed it. They're on three shallows now. I'll try and keep them like that and see how I get on with them next season.
Kitta

 

[BrianO]

Really interesting Thanks

Currently reading the book " The Rose Hive Method " by Tim Rowe, anyone read it ?

One query, appreciate the methodology of giving the bees a large unrestricted brood area, is it not though an issue of when removing honey frames there can be brood present ?

 

[Madge]

Really interesting Thanks

Currently reading the book " The Rose Hive Method " by Tim Rowe, anyone read it ?

One query, appreciate the methodology of giving the bees a large unrestricted brood area, is it not though an issue of when removing honey frames there can be brood present ?

Yes, I've read it - and judging by his post (#8), I guess so has DulwichGnome.

If there's brood among the honey frames, then leave it behind! I check each frame in a honey box before I remove them.

As I've mentioned, I don't use queen excluders (or only very occasionally). What I tend to do, if brood is spread over two shallows above the deep, is I move brood from the top shallow down to the bottom one (and honey frames up to the top one) until I've created a box full of honey frames. The queen won't move up above that. If I've had a one-box system (which I'll have next year with my shallows-only), then that would be even easier. I can continue to move brood frames down and create a honey queen excluder above the brood nest. You can leave honey frames that had brood in them previously for the bees as winter food.

 

[Fatbee]

Brian O you have to remember that queen excluders are for the beekeepers convenience, not the bees. As MF and other posters have proved excluderless colonies are possible and let's the bees develop the nest structure that they desire.

 

[hallshoney]

I decided to try rose method this season so I made fifty boxes enough for ten strong colonies. half I shook swarmed others I reduced to one brood box and added rose box on top. Five followed the method to the letter and other five I altered the method by using drawn supers when the flow got going. The five all on rose boxes made good size colonies two getting into five boxes three made it into three boxes yield wasn't great but considering the amount of wax drawn this was understandable. only one tried to swarm. Swarm management was mostly box tipping. They have most gone into winter in two boxes two on three boxes looking forward to seeing how they do next season as I now have plenty of drawn frames. Extraction didn't go quite to plan as the extractor struggled a bit when full. frames did have a habit of exploding on full speed.

 

[Madge]

... Five followed the method to the letter and other five I altered the method by using drawn supers when the flow got going. The five all on rose boxes made good size colonies two getting into five boxes three made it into three boxes ...

Good to hear. I'll give it a try with my all-shallow hives next year.
Kitta

 

[DulwichGnome]

Good to hear. I'll give it a try with my all-shallow hives next year.
Kitta

If you have a strong nectar flow then shallow boxes will fill very quickly with both brood and honey. I would recommend you have at lest one 'spare' on the bottom of the hive and have another ready above the crown board.

Mike.

 

[Spikedog]

Hi Briano - interested in your thread - Have read the book and hope to run two Rose Hive systems next season. An experiment of sorts. Hope to compare against my nationals. Made inquiry of Irish supplier re Rose Hives but failed to receive a reply. Perhaps a bit awkward to operate two systems and many of my association reluctant to change having invested in national/commercial units. The book reads logical and as a hobbyist has caught my attention. I imagine it will take two/three seasons to be able to assess any positive advancement or impact on bee keeping. Let’s all know how you go.

 

[BrianO]

Hiya

Yeah would echo your comments re the book, halfway through and have to say it seems to make sense in so many areas . I am one year into this fantastic addictive pastime and after a hectic season am going into the winter with 4 hives, remains to be seen how many I have left come April but definitely planning on giving it a go with 2 hives next year. Really looking forward to comparing to my other standard National hives.

Cheers

Brian