What method of swarm control do you use?

[Millet]

May I ask, in the Taranov scheme the Cushman website says the AS can be kept in the same apiary provided it is not positioned too close to the old hive.

What is considered 'too close'?

I would say less than one mile from what i have experienced up to now, but i am sure it will be different every time.

 

[Motobiman]

I would say less than one mile from what i have experienced up to now, but i am sure it will be different every time.

Crickey that's one big apiary . . . . .

 

[psafloyd]

Demarree (swarm avoidance) is my primary weapon, sometimes though, they get ready to get going before I do so in the past I've use Pagden (as with most - 50% success rate) started experimenting with Wally Shaw's 'snelgrove II' method this year and I'm beginning to like it - no more or less fuss than a Pagden - same with the amount of kit you need and seems to have better results.

Will you give us a fuller exposition later in the year, JBM?

I tried demaree this year due to a shortage of time and ready kit and it seemed to work – mostly. But I have read so much about the efficacy of the Snelgrove board and would appreciate a balanced/jaundiced view.

 

[Millet]

Crickey that's one big apiary . . . . .

, I said one mile because if you move the original hive with the old queen in the artificial swarm all the flying bees will go back to the original spot, a lot of flying bees will be lost unless you move it only 3 ft or far enough away.

I moved a Nuc this year with my swarm in it around 25yrds away back to its original spot to unite with what ever was left in the old original brood box in the original position, it had too be moved otherwise i would have left it alone, anyway a hell of a lot of flying bees went back to the spot where the Nuc was and by the amount of flying bees with the old Queen i could see a lot where lost, and maybe robbed there way into my other new hive, another lesson learned for me..

 

[Vortex]

Vortex, have you had a look at the Snellgrove 2 method described by Wally Shaw as it would suit your set up.

I've seen the references on here but not had time to print off the details, study it and work out to apply it .. might get around to it in the winter

You read time and time again to either leave the queen with some brood or transfer her on a frame of brood, if you do this you do not take the swarming impulse out of the hive with the queen, and if she is prolific you chance another swarm.

I'm not going to specifically disagree, but from experience, most of mine choose to try and swarm at somewhere between 5+5 and 8+8 brood. At 5+5 a single split is usually enough to deter them from wanting to swarm, even if I don't move the queen, and if not the second split a week later does..
I both cases there is the proviso that I don't miss any queen cells.

I also replace removed frames either with foundation or drawn comb, and usually the former.

No method is fool proof and I've had 2 colonies over the past 3 years swarm without having capped queen cells. On both occasions it was early to mid May and 6 days after an inspection at which there were no QC, and on both occasions the colonies had an empty honey super on (mixed drawn frames and foundation).

 

[Motobiman]

, I said one mile because if you move the original hive with the old queen in the artificial swarm all the flying bees will go back to the original spot, a lot of flying bees will be lost unless you move it only 3 ft or far enough away.

I moved a Nuc this year with my swarm in it around 25yrds away back to its original spot to unite with what ever was left in the old original brood box in the original position, it had too be moved otherwise i would have left it alone, anyway a hell of a lot of flying bees went back to the spot where the Nuc was and by the amount of flying bees with the old Queen i could see a lot where lost, and maybe robbed there way into my other new hive, another lesson learned for me..

This is the actual wording on the Cushman website that clearly says the AS can be kept in the same apiary, so I don't understand the too close bit, as I like you thought it had to be a fair way away.

Quote
Providing that the swarm is not hived too close to the original stand it can be kept in the same apiary. If it is too close many of the old bees will rejoin their queen which leaves the queenless part somewhat short of resources and defeats our original objective.
Unquote

I wonder if he means move the original hive as well, in which case won't they go to the nearest one?

 

[Millet]

This is the actual wording on the Cushman website that clearly says the AS can be kept in the same apiary, so I don't understand the too close bit, as I like you thought it had to be a fair way away.

Quote
Providing that the swarm is not hived too close to the original stand it can be kept in the same apiary. If it is too close many of the old bees will rejoin their queen which leaves the queenless part somewhat short of resources and defeats our original objective.
Unquote

I wonder if he means move the original hive as well, in which case won't they go to the nearest one?

God knows as i am on a steep learning curve myself, however i do think a lot of flying bees that where lost from the old Queen found there way into the new hive with the Queen cells simply because it is bursting at the seems with bees and it is a little closer to the original Nuc bait hive site than the site where the old Queen is.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Will you give us a fuller exposition later in the year, JBM?

I tried demaree this year due to a shortage of time and ready kit and it seemed to work – mostly. But I have read so much about the efficacy of the Snelgrove board and would appreciate a balanced/jaundiced view.

No probs - just give me a remind - never used a Snelgrove board though -well, not for it's intended purpose anyway

 

[REDWOOD]

I have tried them all and a Demarree works about the best and the Wally split is faultless if you cant find the Queen, although it wasn't called that when I did it, and I didn't re unit like Wally's method.
Swarming should be look at as an opportunity and not a hinderance to beekeepers, you can do so much for the future at this time of year