What did you do in the Apiary today?

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Edit: I am feeding fondant which is two years old...not killed any bees so far

just put the last of 2012's fondant on a few weeks ago

 

[curry756]

I put my first super on today

I did an inspection as its was 11 degrees and lovely and sunny.

Date Time Weather Temp Bees Temperament BIAS Queen Seen? Disease Other

23/03/2015 13:00 Sunny 11 degrees Decent number Good 5 No No 1) Enlarged Entrance
2) QE Under Super
3) Queen Laying in Super
4) Insulation removed


23/03/2015 13:00 Sunny 11 degrees Lots Good 7/8 No No 1) Enlarged Entrance
2) QE and Super added - Comb not drawn
3) Insulation removed


23/03/2015 13:00 Sunny 11 degrees not many Good 3-4 No No 1) Fed 1/2 pk Neopol


23/03/2015 13:00 Sunny 11 degrees not many Angry 3 No No 1) Fed 1/2 pk Neopol


23/03/2015 13:00 Sunny 11 degrees not many Angry 4 No Lots of dead bees on OMF 1) Fed 1 pk Neopol
2) Enlarged Entrance
3) Cleaned dead bees from OMF

 

[enrico]

Still on fondant here Curry, certainly no where near a super!
E

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I put my first super on today

Why - is there a flow on with you?
And why's the queen laying in there already?

 

[curry756]

Still on fondant here Curry, certainly no where near a super!
E

They were running out of places to store food as they had BIAS on over 7 frames and they were starting to build brace comb in the empty super I had put on over winter. So i thought why not add a some frames to the super to see what they do? I will monitor closely, but i though it would be good to know what they do with it.

Lots and lots of bees in that hive too - but the others, well not so many. So fed them to see how they respond.

will keep the thread updated

 

[curry756]

Why - is there a flow on with you?
And why's the queen laying in there already?

Ahh ok - I left a super of stores on Hive 1 over winter. The queen has started laying in here as they are clearing it out, so I pushed them all down and put a QE on. Will check in a few days to check for new eggs.

I also left empty super's on all the hives too to give me space to work/feed over winter without causing them too much annoyance - I read this in the Beekeeping Magazine

So my massive colony - Hive 2, have brood on 7-8 frames - so when thee hatch they will be grateful of the space. They had also started to build brace comb in this empty super, so I added frames of undrawn strips, so if they do want to build comb they can build useful comb, not stuff I am going to pull out.

Was an experiment really, so will monitor closly.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Ahh ok - I left a super of stores on Hive 1 over winter. The queen has started laying in here as they are clearing it out, so I pushed them all down and put a QE on. Will check in a few days to check for new eggs.

Personally, if she was laying in the super only I'd have left it a while before separating her from the brood - unless this one is also a very strong colony they may struggle to cover all the brood

So my massive colony - Hive 2, have brood on 7-8 frames - so when thee hatch they will be grateful of the space. They had also started to build brace comb in this empty super, so I added frames of undrawn strips, so if they do want to build comb they can build useful comb, not stuff I am going to pull out.

OK so you seem to have quite a bit of brood in that hive, just out of curiosity, how much of each frme was filled with brood?

I also left empty super's on all the hives too to give me space to work/feed over winter without causing them too much annoyance - I read this in the Beekeeping Magazine

And what illustrious comic was pushing that daft theory - piling loads of empty space on top of a wintering colony? not evem any waxed frames!!
No wonder most of your colonies had 'not many' in there - the poor buggers must have been struggling to keep warm all winter, unless of course you mean the empty supers were above the crown boards?

 

[Erichalfbee]

OK so you seem to have quite a bit of brood in that hive, just out of curiosity, how much of each frme was filled with brood?


/QUOTE]

Yes....remember, 7 frames of brood is not the same as brood on 7 frames

 

[curry756]

Thanks for your replies.....

Personally, if she was laying in the super only I'd have left it a while before separating her from the brood - unless this one is also a very strong colony they may struggle to cover all the brood

Sorry - she was laying in both, but more bias in the brood chamber - she had only just started laying in the super.

OK so you seem to have quite a bit of brood in that hive, just out of curiosity, how much of each frme was filled with brood?

About 60%

And what illustrious comic was pushing that daft theory - piling loads of empty space on top of a wintering colony? not evem any waxed frames!!
No wonder most of your colonies had 'not many' in there - the poor buggers must have been struggling to keep warm all winter, unless of course you mean the empty supers were above the crown boards?

Beecraft. I cant find the mags now as we are moving house and I binned them all. It was in their section (prob in sept/oct issue) on preparing to overwinter your colonies. They said to leave an empty super or eke under the crownboard. As they wont seal the CB down once winter sets in, so you can open it without disturbing the bees and it gives you room to feed etc if needed. I have always been told (by a very experienced beekeeper) that cold doesn't kill bees - its damp/diseases/starvation that kills them. Although I did insulate the tops.

 

[curry756]

OK so you seem to have quite a bit of brood in that hive, just out of curiosity, how much of each frme was filled with brood?


/QUOTE]

Yes....remember, 7 frames of brood is not the same as brood on 7 frames

good point - answered above

 

[pargyle]

They said to leave an empty super or eke under the crownboard. As they wont seal the CB down once winter sets in, so you can open it without disturbing the bees and it gives you room to feed etc if needed. I have always been told (by a very experienced beekeeper) that cold doesn't kill bees - its damp/diseases/starvation that kills them. Although I did insulate the tops.

The trouble is that some of these very experienced beekeepers are still working on ideas that were flawed in the first place and have just been perpetuated.

Yes, bees will survive in dry cold conditions ... but - if you want them to thrive then isn't it better to give them a space that they can maintain at a temperature and humidity level that they want - without having to use masses of their energy to do it ?

My philosophy is to give them just enough space and increase it only when you are sure that they are going to need it. Empty space in a hive in winter is cold space - it's the last thing they need IMO.

 

[BeeJayBee]

I put my first super on today

I did an inspection as its was 11 degrees and lovely and sunny.

23/03/2015 13:00 Sunny 11 degrees
4) Insulation removed

23/03/2015 13:00 Sunny 11 degrees
2) QE and Super added - Comb not drawn
3) Insulation removed

I'm not sure why you removed the insulation they may have relied on all winter (although they won't have known it was there, they will have felt the benefit). That extra warmth could have encouraged them to draw the brace comb you've mentioned.

At the same time as removing insulation you've added a super, which has added an empty, cold, space above their heads. They need to be warm enough to be able to build comb.

I don't know if your night time temps are the same as here, but it was only 3C a couple of hours ago, and falling. They'll form a cluster at that temperature.

Most people leave insulation on all year round. It keeps the hives warm in winter and cooler in the summer.

 

[curry756]

The trouble is that some of these very experienced beekeepers are still working on ideas that were flawed in the first place and have just been perpetuated.

Yes, bees will survive in dry cold conditions ... but - if you want them to thrive then isn't it better to give them a space that they can maintain at a temperature and humidity level that they want - without having to use masses of their energy to do it ?

My philosophy is to give them just enough space and increase it only when you are sure that they are going to need it. Empty space in a hive in winter is cold space - it's the last thing they need IMO.

This is all well and good, but its peoples opinions and opinions differ. The experienced beekeeper I refer to is a master beekeeper, has written books on beekeeping and is a doctor. So someone I trust implicitly. The beecraft mag said to add an empty super before winter and you (and others will too) contradicting that. Again, I am trusting the magazine that is endorsed by the BBKA. But i do agree that a lot of it is a bit hit and miss, without any proven science - and even that sometimes contradicts each other. I am trying to take peoples opinions on board, but I thought i's go with the magazine's suggestion and find out for myself. Then I can adapt next year. So far I have all my 5 colonies, 2 of which are fairly advanced (for the time of year) and one of which is building comb already. I also read that its good swarm prevention to keep the bees building comb as they will see less of a need to swarm if they can keep building comb out. I am recording my inspections so I can gather my own data as to whether or not I made a mistake.

Some information has made me think a bit more and I will be putting on the insulating back on all the hives tomorrow I will also start feeding the other hives so they all have food. I would hate them to start expanding and then fail to find enough food etc to sustain the growth rate. As someone else pointed its still chilly at night

I do appreciate the time taken to reply to posts though and do value other peoples opinions, so keep em coming. I will make mistakes and you will be the people who make me aware of them, or make me question why I made a decision etc

thanks beejbee too - i replied in this

 

[wessexmario]

Science:
Bees need to keep the brood at 37C.
Simple thermodynamics tells us that in our climate, hives will loose heat energy, which the bees have to continually generate to replace.
Unless you live in the tropics, insulation helps all year around, there's no advantage for taking it off.

 

[busybee53]

As mentioned above: most people keep insulation all year as it helps to keep the bees cool in summer? Never thought of it that way. I may have to re-think. Who else does this?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

T. The experienced beekeeper I refer to is a master beekeeper, has written books on beekeeping and is a doctor.

So was Crippen

 

[madasafish]

As mentioned above: most people keep insulation all year as it helps to keep the bees cool in summer? Never thought of it that way. I may have to re-think. Who else does this?

I have always kept insulation on all year since I started in 2010. (Obvious to anyone with a knowledge of simple physics and the capacity to think for themselves)

Many old style beekeepers are living proof of the existence of dinosaurs- at least based on what they do..

 

[curry756]

Obvious to anyone with a knowledge of simple physics and the capacity to think for themselves

not really as it reduces ventilation - which does not help other problems like chalk brood.

So its not as simple as you say.

Also, mine eat the polystyrene and make holes in it where the crownboard holes are, so I take the fact that they dont like it there during spring/summer etc.

 

[wessexmario]

not really as it reduces ventilation

How does insulation reduce ventilation?

If you have a solid coverboard and OMF, the bees can manage their own ventilation by fanning through the floor and entrance;
Insulation not only reduces losses and fluctuations of heat, but it also helps to increase humidity while reducing condensation on the inside of the hive, both of which are beneficial increments when compared to the old setup.

Bees are quite adept at managing ventilation in a confined chamber. Swarm scouts show a preference for new hive locations with a single entrance no bigger than 3 inches, they don't like locations that have a constant natural air flow.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Also, mine eat the polystyrene and make holes in it where the crownboard holes are, so I take the fact that they dont like it there during spring/summer etc.

Why on earth do you have gaping holes in the crown boards to start with?