What are my chances of success?

[Beeforest]

I have just set up two bait hives. They each are over 3m from the ground. Each hive contains some wax started strips from the top bars and a few drops of lemon grass oil. I have a bee keeper about 800m away who has 20 + hives. I chatted to him today and enquired about his method of swarm control - basically he doesn't. I didn't give away my dastardly plan...

I'm thinking my chances are fairly high that I will populate both hives sometime this year.

 

[mexbigshow]

your chances are as good as any, i have a beek 3 allotments down with 5 hives no swarm control so i just baited my top bar hive just near the ground not high up and within a few weeks bees moved in and they overwintered well and are still thriving
chris

 

[SixFooter]

Mine are 6 - 7 ft up and have a little old comb inside. Hit rate is about 1 in 2 over a year.
Actually much better than that last year, but there was a lot of swarming in the area.

 

[countryman]

put yourself in his shoes would you like it!!!!!! if i found out someone did that to me there bait hives would be spread every where just not done to another beek full stop

 

[Beeforest]

put yourself in his shoes would you like it!!!!!! if i found out someone did that to me there bait hives would be spread every where just not done to another beek full stop

Well, being a countryman I'm sure you are aware of the trespass laws!

Actually I wouldn't mind it. Once the bees naturally swarm and they decide to take up residence elsewhere - good luck to them.
This Beek is of the same opinion when I asked him today about his swarm control measures, saying 'Once they go they spread all around, it's nature's way.'
They are free to choose any place to reside; including on my land!

 

[richardbees]

I disagree Countryman

Better a swarm ends up in a bait hive than the hood of a baby's pram

 

[simonf]

 

[Winker]

put yourself in his shoes would you like it!!!!!! if i found out someone did that to me there bait hives would be spread every where just not done to another beek full stop

The lad said he had no swarm control methods, he just lets his hives swarm, so why not gather his free bees?

If you cant control your bees from swarming, once there gone there no longer your bees

 

[MandF]

Isnt it still a bit early for bait hives?

I wasnt planning to put mine out for another couple of weeks

 

[Arfermo]

put yourself in his shoes would you like it!!!!!! if i found out someone did that to me there bait hives would be spread every where just not done to another beek full stop

No certainty they would be his swarm - but I s'pose it might just be a nice diplomatic gesture just to ask. Anyway, that apart, best effect would be to but some smelly old comb with some honey brushed on in the bait hive too?

 

[psafloyd]

put yourself in his shoes would you like it!!!!!! if i found out someone did that to me there bait hives would be spread every where just not done to another beek full stop

Hang on, that's like complaining about a high water bill because you left the tap running.

 

[oliver90owner]

Smearing with sugar solution containing some honey from the same hive will help too. (my underlining) (from another thread this am)

with some honey brushed on in the bait hive too?

First quote from another thread but the same person is OK. IMO, it needs only be honey from your own bees, and most certainly not supermarket stuff (which could so easily contain AFB spores).

The second is a definite no-no. Possibly encouraging robbing and most certainly very poor practice. A very good way to spread disease around the area - your honey may not be a disease vector, but all the bees, from wherever, which come along to rob it out may well be a source of infection.

You need to think about all 'advice' very carefully, and not accept it on face value. Some is not good at all. Think about it - carefully - first as there are some out there that don't.

 

[itma]

If I understand my Seeley, bait hive volume, entrance size and orientation are critical factors, as are the height and old comb (rather than starter strips).

Preferred volume at about 40 litres is actually rather smaller than a single Nat brood. (Try a nuc?)
Entrance, restricted not open, and facing South-ish for the sun.
I wonder whether an old hive, or even used frames, would serve better (rather than actual old comb as such) to satisfy the swarm-scouts that this possible home had been home to bees in the past. IIRC Seeley was distinguishing between otherwise identical (essentially new) swarm boxes. Long term, comb might be more like a moth-bait hive ...


ADDED -
And, if the swarm has swarmed, its not anyone's property.
Although I do go along with the "custom and practice" that a following beekeeper has the moral (but not I believe legal) right to first shot at collecting it.
Putting up a bait hive isn't encouraging swarming, its about gathering-in a swarm that has flown.

 

[oliver90owner]

Preferred volume at about 40 litres is actually rather smaller than a single Nat brood.

Not so.

 

[mbc]

Preferred volume at about 40 litres is actually rather smaller than a single Nat brood.

Not so.

Is so

 

[beestie]

 

[Beeforest]

Thanks for the ideas regarding old comb and size of hive. I'm actually using a complete hive using two warre supers which much smaller than national supers.
My thinking being that if I don't spot the swarm on the day it arrives I will leave it in situ for the natural comb to fill the supers then to move it more than 3 miles away and bring it back to the apiary in autumn. Failing that move it in the winter to the apiary on the same site as the bait hive.

The entrance is restricted as are Warre hives. I think I will mention the bait hives now when I next see the beek, I don't think he will mind.

 

[BeeJayBee]

I have a bee keeper about 800m away who has 20 + hives.

That's a little under half a mile away, in a straight line.

Realistically, how would anybody know if somebody has put bait hives out about half a mile from their apiary, especially in urban, or semi-urban areas?

I've read this about bait hives http://www.honeybeesuite.com/my-design-for-a-bait-hive/ and am in the process of making one of these http://www.beesource.com/build-it-yourself/5-frame-nuc-d-coates-version/ with a slight adjustment of the measurements.

 

[Skyhook]

Is so

Tried measuring it?

 

[Bucks_Boy]

That's a little under half a mile away, in a straight line.

Realistically, how would anybody know if somebody has put bait hives out about half a mile from their apiary, especially in urban, or semi-urban areas?

I've read this about bait hives http://www.honeybeesuite.com/my-design-for-a-bait-hive/ and am in the process of making one of these http://www.beesource.com/build-it-yourself/5-frame-nuc-d-coates-version/ with a slight adjustment of the measurements.

Guy about 100 yards away from my old main apiary put up 3 bait hives, got nothing for 3 years running -- didnt like to tell him I clipped as it was an urban site.

I gave him a nuc when I moved !