Using just top bars in national supers

[Antipodes]

Or there's these (for the frames), if they're any help. I know nothing about them though. Just saw the ad on FB.

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James

That is how we do the wire and wax down here. No zig-zagging of wire.

 

[rolande]

Morning as per title has any one used just the top bars with strips in honey supers?
Thanks

Yes. Of course *I* have! The financial constraints of the early years demanded all kinds of improvisations; that or standing still and never getting anywhere.

Best to tag short sides (similar to apidea frames) that way you get near on zero connection to the sidewalls. Don't have any photos of the dadants set up but I have a few warre photos (in fact, it was the early cost saving ideas that suggested the potential for using a few warres), the principal is identical although obviously the Warre gets away with lighter material.

If you don't add the short sides and comb gets tied to the sidewalls of the super the easiest thing is to turn the box upside down, use a hive tool to cut the joins and then to press down slightly on the underside of the bars to break any propolis join, then pull the box off rather than trying to pull the bars out of the box like frames.

Not ideal, it really isn't. But if it gets honey in boxes that would otherwise remain empty then you'd best get on with it.

 

[Curly green finger's]

Yes. Of course *I* have! The financial constraints of the early years demanded all kinds of improvisations; that or standing still and never getting anywhere.

Best to tag short sides (similar to apidea frames) that way you get near on zero connection to the sidewalls. Don't have any photos of the dadants set up but I have a few warre photos (in fact, it was the early cost saving ideas that suggested the potential for using a few warres), the principal is identical although obviously theView attachment 36659 Warre gets away with lighter material.

If you don't add the short sides and comb gets tied to the sidewalls of the super the easiest thing is to turn the box upside down, use a hive tool to cut the joins and then to press down slightly on the underside of the bars to break any propolis join, then pull the box off rather than trying to pull the bars out of the box like frames.

Not ideal, it really isn't. But if it gets honey in boxes that would otherwise remain empty then you'd best get on with it.

Already have got on with it I haven’t used any side bars at all

 

[pargyle]

Already have got on with it I haven’t used any side bars at all

I'd be interested to know how you get on spinning the honey out - or are you just intending using it for chunk honey or cut comb ?

 

[Curly green finger's]

I'd be interested to know how you get on spinning the honey out - or are you just intending using it for chunk honey or cut comb ?

Aye either for chunk or finishing of on the heather and crushing to make a natural heather blend.

I’ve got a long handled knife to cut the comb from the boxes if needs be.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

what is confusing me is, you seem to have plenty of top bars.
so where did the side and bottom bars go?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Already have got on with it I haven’t used any side bars at all

Anywhere?

 

[rolande]

I imagine that @Curly green finger's is using strip wood for bars. Sound enough idea if we think that one full box so fitted (and the added labour) might pay for a couple of hundred second quality frames next year but an empty box, unused due to lack of frames won't pay for anything next year. As Norman Rice wrote in Queens' Land, don't let the lack of the proper kit get in the way of a good idea.

 

[Erichalfbee]

https://beekeepingforum.co.uk/threads/what-did-you-do-in-the-apiary-today.8543/page-1837#post-869363

 

[user 20297]

I imagine that @Curly green finger's is using strip wood for bars. Sound enough idea if we think that one full box so fitted (and the added labour) might pay for a couple of hundred second quality frames next year but an empty box, unused due to lack of frames won't pay for anything next year. As Norman Rice wrote in Queens' Land, don't let the lack of the proper kit get in the way of a good idea.

....or let a lack of experience get in the way of trying something new.

 

[rolande]

....or let a lack of experience get in the way of trying something new.

True, although it's usually too much beekeeping experience that stops improvisation!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

....or let a lack of experience get in the way of trying something new.

or common sense

 

[user 20297]

or common sense

Common sense often develops from someone who tries something that is uncommon sense. There are quite a few accepted techniques in beekeeping that I suspect met with a frosty reception from commonsense folk when first mooted.

 

[pargyle]

True, although it's usually too much beekeeping experience that stops improvisation!

I rather think that deviating from accepted practice is a good thing ... if you are a hobby beekeeper with the time and the inclination to try something different. Occasionally something different works or at least you find out what doesn't and inevitably learn on the journey ! I've loved experimenting over the years and flying in the face of perceived wisdom. However, I don't rely on my bees for my income, I don't have 100+ hives and I'm not a budding bee farmer. If I did and I was, I don't think I would be treading too far from the well trodden paths ~ fools step in...

 

[user 20297]

I rather think that deviating from accepted practice is a good thing ... if you are a hobby beekeeper with the time and the inclination to try something different. Occasionally something different works or at least you find out what doesn't and inevitably learn on the journey ! I've loved experimenting over the years and flying in the face of perceived wisdom. However, I don't rely on my bees for my income, I don't have 100+ hives and I'm not a budding bee farmer. If I did and I was, I don't think I would be treading too far from the well trodden paths ~ fools step in...

You're right...no-one ever became a millionaire by coming up a new idea.

 

[rolande]

I rather think that deviating from accepted practice is a good thing ... if you are a hobby beekeeper with the time and the inclination to try something different. Occasionally something different works or at least you find out what doesn't and inevitably learn on the journey ! I've loved experimenting over the years and flying in the face of perceived wisdom. However, I don't rely on my bees for my income, I don't have 100+ hives and I'm not a budding bee farmer. If I did and I was, I don't think I would be treading too far from the well trodden paths ~ fools step in...

I might well be a fool, but not as big a fool as I would have been to take a raincheck during a honeyflow due to a lack of frames.

 

[drex]

I suggest to beginners that they stick with conventional methods for a couple of years, and then, if they want, look into other ways.
I have dug some newcomers out of a right mess because they went straight for top bar hives etc.
I have experiment with several different hives, learned a lot I might not have otherwise, but am back to standard Nationals. I still experiment with different techniques though.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I have dug some newcomers out of a right mess because they went straight for top bar hives

It was the first bee container I ever got....well Stan made it.....
I looked at it for a long time then ended up putting plants in it

 

[pargyle]

It was the first bee container I ever got....well Stan made it.....
I looked at it for a long time then ended up putting plants in it

I made TWO - a Kenyan which I took apart to make a Tanzanian which I took apart and made my long hive ... I've dabbled with top bar hives over the years ... it's fascinating seeing what bees do when you leave them largely to build what they want - but ... There is a convenience to having frames in a hive but I've always been foundationless so the bees get to do what they want anyway ... they don't seem to mind being restricted by side and bottom bars.

 

[drex]

Yes, Philip, I ended up converting my Kenyan to a long hive taking National frames. Good bit of kit