Using a drill/screwing

[the naked beekeeper]

Go easy on me as I am a complete DIY novice and trying to teach myself.

When you screw screws into wood, how do you do it so it's just one easy process that slides in first time?

It takes me about 5mins per screw.
Yesterday I was trying to screw two wood ends together. I got 2 revolutions of the screw if lucky, before the drill flew off and kept flying into the wood denting it. I had one hand holding the wood and one hand holding the drill....after 10 minutes trying to get 2 screws in my hand was killing me from holding it and twisting it!! Why won't it just go in first time in one action, like I see everyone else do?!

 

[Black Comb]

A few ideas.
Have you the drill set on the lowest speed?
Are you using the correct bit for that size screw?
Flat head (slotted) screws are difficult to insert using a drill. Use Pozi heads screws if possible, making sure the bit matches the number on the box, e.g Pozi 2 is very popular size screw so you need a Pozi 2 bit to fit into these.

It helps if you drill small pilot hole first. (higher setting best for this)

Practice on scrap wood til you get it right.

 

[MJBee]

I always drill pilot holes then lay the piece flat and start the screws using the drill driver on the slowest speed. Drive the screws until the points are just through. Mate up the pieces to be joined and drive the screws home. If the drill is jumping off the screw is the correct screw bit being used? Most bits are marked and the bit type will be on the screw container.

Hope this helps

 

[oliver90owner]

Practise with a manual screwdriver. It may be safer that way.

Think 'fix parts in position', before attempting to do it freehand. Safer that way.

Well at least secure one part in a fixed position before attempting to join them.

RAB

 

[DarynWebb]

Drill pilot holes this will make life so much easier

 

[wightbees]

Also the type of screw helps alot.The better ones just glide through the wood.
And umm.... you are using wood screws arent you

 

[fatshark]

Clamp one or both pieces of wood so you've got a free hand to guide things better.

 

[Skyhook]

All the above, plus use a magnetic drill bit holder. The magnetism goes through the bit and holds the screw onto the bit.

Make sure the bit and the screw are in a straight line, and press firmly so the bit is secure in the screw. And if you have traditional staight woodscrews (with a line across the head), throw them away and get pozidrive superscrews.

 

[youngyoungs]

All of the above!

I too am a complete novice but this summer I built a nuc and three hive stands.

Everything everyone has said above is very wise.

Pilot holes are definitely recommended, without them I split the wood and/or needed the OH to screw in the screws. I always used an electrical screwdriver to drive in the screws.

I also used an old Workmate to clamp one piece of wood, drills and hammers are dangerous enough without having the wood flying about.

Do persevere - even if the product isn't very pretty, the bees won't mind.

 

[the naked beekeeper]

Thanks all for the replies!

I forgot to mention:

I had the drill on the lowest setting!! I glued the pieces roughly together to help and I drilled pilot holes.

The screw was a fair bit bigger than it though. How wide in comparison to the screws are pilot holes meant to be? Obviously it can't be waggling away in there. Is it sort of a hole 2/3rds the width of the screw?


Onto the more technical stuff....the screws I used were ones with a one-straight line through the head. A - rather than a +.
They were in an unlabelled pot I've got (got a few of those!) with screws in.
Bought them down Trago. They had the price on and that was it.

The bit which goes in the drill, I picked it from a 'set' I've got in a fold out case from Woolworths. I don't think they've got any special numbers on to match up.
I just picked that one as it fit best, compared to the other flat one I tried.

So what I've learnt so far..use wood screws (if for wood) and use pozidrive screws. And if possible clamp. I haven't got one but can ask around.

 

[onriver]

I'd agree with the bits of advice you've had and I'd just want to emphasise the need to have good screws to work with - I've a few 'straight' ones I swear I only keep for sentimental value, please just throw them away and get decent screws matched with decent screwdriver bits. It really does help to transform the experience of putting things together from something so frustrating it makes you swear out loud to something that makes you feel you can do anything - just bring it on!

 

[BeeJayBee]

How wide in comparison to the screws are pilot holes meant to be?

Equal to the next size smaller screw would be best, but smaller than that if your hand wobbles whilst using the drill.

If you've used too much glue it could have made the wood damp, damp wood can make screws drag. Least worst option would be to add a tiny dab of oil to the point of the screw, to reduce friction.

Make sure you're pointing the screw in exactly the same direction as the pilot hole, a slight angle off will mean you're trying to push the screw into undrilled timber.

Sometimes a ratchet screwdriver is easier to use than an electric one.

 

[the naked beekeeper]

I'd agree with the bits of advice you've had and I'd just want to emphasise the need to have good screws to work with - I've a few 'straight' ones I swear I only keep for sentimental value, please just throw them away and get decent screws matched with decent screwdriver bits. It really does help to transform the experience of putting things together from something so frustrating it makes you swear out loud to something that makes you feel you can do anything - just bring it on!

Ok. So all screws should be a +.

Most bits seem to fit into them.

When screwing in are you meant to push the screw partially in before screwing, to stabilise it, or just screw the whole length in from tip to head?

 

[Skyhook]

Ok. So all screws should be a +.

Most bits seem to fit into them.

When screwing in are you meant to push the screw partially in before screwing, to stabilise it, or just screw the whole length in from tip to head?

Please note there are 3 main types of screw head- the straight ones obviously, then those with just a + are phillips head and a bit old-fashioned now. Pozidriv is more like a union jack, you'll see they have 8 points, 4 large 4 small. Most decent modern screws will be pozidriv, don't use a phillips bit or it will slip. Get decent screws, eg from a timber merchants not pound shop, and pref. not homebase or B&Q- theres a real difference.

You should be able to spin the drill very slowly (once every 1-2 seconds) with a screw stuck on the end. If your trigger control will allow this, you should be able to do the same with the tip of the screw pressed gently against the wood- you can use thumb and finger of hand B to hold the screw on to the bit if you need, at this speed you wont hurt yourself. After a few revolutions the screw will start to bite, increase the pressure and remove your fingers if you feel the need. To start with keep the speed very slow, you can speed up as you gain confidence.

 

[rae]

Get decent screws, eg from a timber merchants not pound shop, and pref. not homebase or B&Q- theres a real difference.

This is important. Get proper screws - Spax are way out there in quality and consistency. The have sharp points, self cutting starter threads and countersinks built into the head. With these, you need no pilot, no countersink, nothing - just screw them in. Yes they are a bit more expensive, but we're talking a few quid a year for the average beek. Yes, if you're doing proper finish carpentry you need to countersink and/or plug, but for beehive assembly, no requirement to do this. I've driven a 4" one of these straight into a solid oak beam with no preparation at all. You can get them in stainless as well.

As others have said, pozi is the answer, and if you're really having a problem with screws, get Torx. No chance of slipping and you've got to be a gorilla to strip them.

 

[madasafish]

Quote:
Get decent screws, eg from a timber merchants not pound shop, and pref. not homebase or B&Q- theres a real difference.


Agreed. And timber merchants are usually cheaper as well...

(One caveat. Aldi sell boxes of pozidrive screws. I have found these very good value and quality. But they are only available in Offers so not normally stocked).

 

[Black Comb]

Yes, you are using slotted head screws which are a real pain to insert with a drill.
I use Reisser, blurb says they are 20 times more rust resistant than normal steel.
Spax also very good. Pozi heads of course.

If they came from Trago they would be seconds or even thirds.

 

[DulwichGnome]

Here is a good guide to what you can buy,
http://www.screwfix.com/c/screws-nails-fixings/woodscrews/cat840066?cm_sp=SNF-_-Screws-_-Woodscrews
Using the right bit (and throwing it away when it's worn out) is an important element to not damaging your work. I've found these to be a good value/quality,
http://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-pozi-tic-tac-box-screwdriver-bits-pz-2-x-50mm-15pcs/33178.

Mike.

I used the Spax type when I did a lot of theatre/scenic fitting and they will go in and out very cleanly and can be used a few times before throwing away.

 

[yeogi75]

general rule of thumb, put the drill bit up to the shaft of the screw should be about the same diameter, the threads will be slightly bigger, if not sure use drill bit slightly smaller than the shaft.
good woodworking
ps if you are still having problems holding the wood put two small nails in to hold the wood together and screw between nails

 

[iand]

To-day I have been using 120mm Reisser cutter screws, sharp point to self start so no pilot hole, lubricated screw so drives a dream, then the c/s helps make its own recess. Part of the idea of these screws is that they are less likely to split the wood so useful when working near the end of the job. BUT they are more expensive, I usually reserve this type for special jobs, but the std ones are usually OK for most jobs.

Again a posidrive head for a power driver, no 3 in use to-day.
They are are all numbered 1 for little fiddly screws, 2 a general purpose screws, no3 for big butch screws.
Sometimes a bit maybe supplied in the box, but best to ask and get a spare at the same time. If a little off line you can soon chew the screw and bit to shreds.
Best to secure the job because a lot of torgue can be generated driving bigger screws in.