Shook swarms - all bees, every spring

[JamezF]

Because muppets need a hobby horse?

I couldn't deny that as a perfectly logical conclusion.

James

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

How one gets from that to "It sounds like you are wanting to perform a shook swarm" is beyond me.

Because muppets need a hobby horse

Fazakerley it seems to be the main obsession with the BBKA lately - and as a consequence, the NBU who chant the shook swarm mantra as the cure for almost everything

 

[JamezF]

which is the very last instance where you would want to further stress a sick colony by conducting one

Yes, I had been giving that some thought. David is only discussing experimental results, but I wonder if the experiment might stem from trying to find a path that complies with both the spirit and the letter of the law that allows both phoretic mites and those in cells to be killed at the same time.

In the same situation others might perhaps decide that the best way to try to achieve a similar effect is to make sure their wooden hive parts are spotlessly clean by bleaching them multiple times over two or three weeks, but it is possibly awkward for David to promote that as an appropriate course of action.

James

 

[Ian123]

Yes, I had been giving that some thought. David is only discussing experimental results, but I wonder if the experiment might stem from trying to find a path that complies with both the spirit and the letter of the law that allows both phoretic mites and those in cells to be killed at the same time.

In the same situation others might perhaps decide that the best way to try to achieve a similar effect is to make sure their wooden hive parts are spotlessly clean by bleaching them multiple times over two or three weeks, but it is possibly awkward for David to promote that as an appropriate course of action.

James

I told a couple of bee inspectors 20 years ago if you did a Winter Oxalic there’s no need to shook swarm/treatment in Spring or exceptionally rarely. That’s the whole point of Winter treating giving a clean as possible start to the season.

 

[Ian123]

This day and age I’m surprised none have also considered the views of the average snow flake, and how this completely pointless exercise could be perceived.

 

[judy12]

And on and on and on about the illegality of calling honey "pure" or "raw" when every supermarket in the land describes their 454g for £1.80 jars as "pure and natural" honey.

 

[jeff33]

Just got BBKA News - in the q&a section, Gareth Morgan says he shook-swarms all his colonies in spring. Who else does this? Some people say they only do it to weak and sick colonies and others only strong ones. What are your views?

One certainly knows how to get this forum going

I am starting to wonder if the BBKA journal is an internal plot aimed at throwing regular ticking time bombs at this forum knowing full well that almost everyone will be up in arms, causing chaos, disbelief and sometimes heated discussions!!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

One certainly knows how to get this forum going

I am starting to wonder if the BBKA journal is an internal plot aimed at throwing regular ticking time bombs at this forum knowing full well that almost everyone will be up in arms, causing chaos, disbelief and sometimes heated discussions!!

I don't think, even if they all pool their wits (or halves) together that they could gather the intellect to plot such a scheme

 

[Erichalfbee]

Beats the boredom when there are no bees to play with

 

[user 819]

I looked on the LBKA close to me and it is there in the apiary training intinary for 27 May ' Shook swarm for varroa control'.
A yearly ritual to stress the bees.

 

[Ian123]

Send them a mail now suggesting an oxalic vape. They can then use the day for something more productive like a show and tell on open feeding methods

 

[user 819]

I use to be a member and once was on the committee for several years to influence thoughts but to no avail, OA sublimination is all but frowned upon. They are a one trick pony when it comes to certain teachings, shook is one and then later only MAQS is allowed for Autumn. Having any view out of the BBKA teaching dogma then one is wasting their own precious time.

 

[W0otz]

OA sublimination is all but frowned upon.

To be fair, unless using Api-Bioxal, it is technically illegal to use sublimated OA for varroa control.

Even using Api-Bioxal you can only do a single annual treatment, so a winter vape is fine but a course of vapes for autumn treatment isn't. From the "B) Posology and method of administration by vaporisation" section of the leaflet on the VMD site:

Dose is 2.3g per hive as a single administration. Maximal dose 2.3g per hive as a single administration. One treatment per year.

Nothing wrong with being treatment free and cleaning your top bars using sublimated OA over several sessions a few days apart though.

 

[JamezF]

Even using Api-Bioxal you can only do a single annual treatment, so a winter vape is fine but a course of vapes for autumn treatment isn't. From the "B) Posology and method of administration by vaporisation" section of the leaflet on the VMD site:

I was reading that document a couple of days ago and (whilst some may not wish to) it struck me that nothing I could see appears to prohibit using both methods of application in a single year. I wonder if that is intentional or an oversight.

James

 

[Ian123]

But it says a single annual use of the product, so liquid or vape the application method is irrelevant?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

To be fair, unless using Api-Bioxal, it is technically illegal to use sublimated OA for varroa control.

another thing we can thank the BBKA for

 

[JamezF]

But it says a single annual use of the product, so liquid or vape the application method is irrelevant?

Trickling allows two treatments, so one would therefore assume the number of applications is specific to the method, not overall.

Actually, given the way the document is written I'm not sure that it wouldn't be a valid interpretation that both trickling and sublimation must be used. I can't see that it says anywhere that you may choose either one or the other, or that they're mutually exclusive, even if that's what they (probably) intended.

James

 

[pevanstone]

A dear friend Lorain Stevens was advised by the powers that be to shook swarm.that was early spring,l think l remember twelve colonies,young brood destroyed,it was a disaster.end of May strong colonies last year it might have worked.l just offer this for new beekeepers.

 

[Xander]

I think my (now ex) mentor must be reading the BBKA magazine as he recommends dusting with icing sugar and says oa vape is illegal no discussion, Hence my seeking opinions from professional keepers and experienced hobbyists on this site. I joined but only for the insurance as I've been offered the use of some land as an out apiary which will hopefully allow me to make increase to a comfortable number of hives, enough to get me out of trouble if any should perish and to provide me and family with plenty of honey.

 

[Erichalfbee]

May strong colonies last year it might have worked.

No point in that either