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madasafish said:
Yes,Paul.. significantly high drops ..|Hence the decision to move them to an out apiary to prevent their drones breeding with open mated queens..
Click to expand...

That makes a lot of sense.
I'm surprised, given the Irish input (cited by Quis Custodiet), that they haven't got a testing and selective breeding programme going.
There are groups in:

A.m. mellifera

Present code future Code Name
4 DE-24 Landesverband Brandenburgischer Imker e.V./Mellifera
8 DE-28 Landesverband der Imker Mecklenburg Vorpommern e.V./Mellifera
14 DE-34 Imkerverband Sachsen-Anhalt e.V./Mellifera
15 DE-35 Landesverband Schleswig-Holsteinischer und Hamburger Imker e.V./Mellifera
50 CH-50 Verein Schweizerischer Mellifera Bienenfreunde
64 NO-1 Norway/Mellifera
99 AT-1 AMZ (Austrian Mellifera Züchter)
57 BE-2 Limburgse Zwarte Bij (LZB vzw)
PL-1 Poland/SmartBees/Mellifera
FR-1 France/Mellifera
 
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Taken From Catherine Thompson's PhD about DNA analysis on Colonsay (and other) bees.
5.9). Orkney A and Colonsay A were the purest samples (figure 5.9). Orkney A only showed introgression from Spanish iberica and German carnica in one individual from the sample (figure 5.10). Colonsay had introgression from a greater number of races (New Zealand ligustica, Australian ligustica etc) but A. m. mellifera levels were less variable between samples A and B.
Figure 5.9
Figure59.jpg
 
Am I right in thinking new stock must have been fairly recent given the traces of Australian/New Zealand ligustica, of does imports from their go back further than I think?
 
SDM said:
Am I right in thinking new stock must have been fairly recent given the traces of Australian/New Zealand ligustica, of does imports from their go back further than I think?
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Probably mainly after IofW disease decimated many bee populations. Post World War 1 there were massive imports of bees from all over the world to replace bee stocks.
Anything over 80% "pure" is usually enough to distinguish them as a pure strain. The traces of alien genomes won't go away. They are detectable remnants of past history, not necessarily recent crosses.
 
Beefriendly said:
Taken From Catherine Thompson's PhD about DNA analysis on Colonsay (and other) bees.
5.9). Orkney A and Colonsay A were the purest samples (figure 5.9). Orkney A only showed introgression from Spanish iberica and German carnica in one individual from the sample (figure 5.10). Colonsay had introgression from a greater number of races (New Zealand ligustica, Australian ligustica etc) but A. m. mellifera levels were less variable between samples A and B.
Figure 5.9
Figure59.jpg
Click to expand...

Do you have a link to an online copy of this? I'm sure more than a few people would like to read the full document
 
Beefriendly said:
Probably mainly after IofW disease decimated many bee populations. Post World War 1 there were massive imports of bees from all over the world to replace bee stocks.
.
Click to expand...
Australia/New Zealand was a hell of a distance to ship bees in the early 1900's
 
SDM said:
Australia/New Zealand was a hell of a distance to ship bees in the early 1900's
Click to expand...
It was indeed but we were already shipping bees to the antipodes and USA when the only transport was sailing ships.
For example European bees (Amm's from just outside Thirsk in North Yorkshire) were first successfully introduced into Tasmania/Australia in 1831.
 
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Quis Custodiet said:
Young Man, I have noticed your provocative attitude many times, not that it matters very much. You are a newcomer to beekeeping, why not try being less hostile and aggressive and people may not notice your obvious feelings of inadequacy and your religious and political bigotry. Life is too short...enjoy the sunshine.
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Keep that sort of stuff to yourself!
 
madasafish said:
Well they were 1 year old queens. Survived winter but high varroa loads.. Much higher than Association Apiary averages. Treated as other bees - Apiguard plus winter OA .. They were not particularly good tempered nor did their honey yields excite so shunted off into a member's out apiary..

I thought that the hype around Colonsay bees would mean they would have some outstanding qualities.. as far as I could see, their high varroa loads were the only outstanding property.

( I am trying to be diplomatic)
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What on earth would you expect, some sort of magical immunity? Totally irresponsible IMO and not much consideration. Why subject an innocent creature to the joys of varroa when Amm from other sources are available? Shameful.
 
foghornleghorn said:
We're waiting a long time for the research to be published on how pure the Irish population suposedly is.

It was largely funded by the native bee brigade...
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It is due to be published on May24th and the referendum on whether abortions will be allowed in southern Ireland is I understand, to be held on May25th and to top it all the Pope is stopping by in August.....wonderful country!
There is a persistent claim that Nature journal refused to publish the research. I clearly recall reading a post on here saying that is where or clearly implying that it would be published there. One has to wonder why the services of professional laboratories have not been used...it would certainly have been quicker and much less expensive.
 
Quis Custodiet said:
It is due to be published on May24th and the referendum on whether abortions will be allowed in southern Ireland is I understand, to be held on May25th and to top it all the Pope is stopping by in August.....wonderful country!
There is a persistent claim that Nature journal refused to publish the research. I clearly recall reading a post on here saying that is where or clearly implying that it would be published there. One has to wonder why the services of professional laboratories have not been used...it would certainly have been quicker and much less expensive.
Click to expand...

This is not a political forum!
 
Quis Custodiet said:
There is a persistent claim that Nature journal refused to publish the research..
Click to expand...

To get a paper published in Nature/Nature Genetics/Nature whatever is very very difficult. They only publish the highest quality research and it needs to be an extraordinaire finding or extremely exciting. I don't think a simple paper comparing and matching genome sequences would cut the mustard there.
I doubt the authors would have submitted it to Nature, but if they did they overestimated the importance of their findings or... the reviewers (if it got that far) found faults in their methodology and conclusions that made it unsuitable for publication (rejection).
More likely to be published in comparative genetics type journal.
 
Beefriendly said:
To get a paper published in Nature/Nature Genetics/Nature whatever is very very difficult. They only publish the highest quality research and it needs to be an extraordinaire finding or extremely exciting. I don't think a simple paper comparing and matching genome sequences would cut the mustard there.
I doubt the authors would have submitted it to Nature, but if they did they overestimated the importance of their findings or... the reviewers (if it got that far) found faults in their methodology and conclusions that made it unsuitable for publication (rejection).
More likely to be published in comparative genetics type journal.
Click to expand...

:iagree:
Nature has very high standards
 
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