Re using frames

[Katherine]

You can’t shake bees out if they do not have another hive to go to

I should have said they don't have a queen right hive to go to. I have another hive but it looks queenless. They could go to this one, but I thinks it's just a question of time before there are no bees left here. The last time I looked there was fresh drone brood only.

 

[ericbeaumont]

They could go to this one

They will.

 

[ericbeaumont]

don't have a queen right hive

All is not lost: you have a window of opportunity to resolve the issue before laying workers begin. What have you tried so far?

Options: beg a patch of eggs and larvae from another beekeeper and slot it into a frame of comb in the nest; buy a queen: ask your BKA or go online; throw a swarm in.

 

[Katherine]

Thank you for those suggestions. The two bks I know have also lost colonies due to exceptional bad weather in May and have not been forthcoming...
At the moment I have a swarm trap which has a great deal of activity around it these last 3 days. I don't think the swarm is in there yet, but I'm checking daily (knocking to hear a reaction) I have another hive, hive B, primed with 4 frames of partially drawn comb and 4 with starter strips which is also being visited by scouts. If I shook out the bees, from queenless hive C, as in the previous comments, into say possibly laying worker hive A ( not sure of this yet) I could use a bit of old comb to tempt the said scouts.
My question is thus. What to do with hive A? Can I combine it if I do get a swarm in hive B?
Or would it be better to use the colony that installs in the swarm trap?
I don't want to chuck a swarm in because the hive is not on the frames I want to use and the comb is very old.
It seems jumble, hope you can follow!

 

[Katherine]

All is not lost: you have a window of opportunity to resolve the issue before laying workers begin. What have you tried so far?

Options: beg a patch of eggs and larvae from another beekeeper and slot it into a frame of comb in the nest; buy a queen: ask your BKA or go online; throw a swarm in.

Further to my long reply, I have just thought that I don't want to combine any bees with a laying worker, if I identify the colony as such do I? So I should be thinking of adding to the swarms, if they do eventually settle in. Is this right?

 

[ericbeaumont]

Chances of laying workers increase once all brood has emerged and brood pheromone is absent.

Read bushfarms/layingworkers
Shake-out best option.

Will read your latest chapter tonight, but must go to bees.

 

[ericbeaumont]

laying worker hive A ( not sure of this yet)

What to do with hive A? Can I combine it if I do get a swarm in hive B?

Least risky option is to chuck out in the apiary on a flying day anything queenless or laying worker, once you have a Q+ swarm in a hive. By all means, if the Q- colony C is strong use newspaper to unite as it'll cause less stress.

Make sure to remove all surplus kit and stands from the apiary so that bees relocate to the only option available.

As the main flow is about to start (blackberry opening yesterday in London), and as swarms work to produce far more than a standard colony, your new single will make plenty of honey. Once the Q is laying well, you could split and increase to two colonies.

 

[Katherine]

Least risky option is to chuck out in the apiary on a flying day anything queenless or laying worker, once you have a Q+ swarm in a hive. By all means, if the Q- colony C is strong use newspaper to unite as it'll cause less stress.

Make sure to remove all surplus kit and stands from the apiary so that bees relocate to the only option available.

As the main flow is about to start (blackberry opening yesterday in London), and as swarms work to produce far more than a standard colony, your new single will make plenty of honey. Once the Q is laying well, you could split and increase to two colonies.

Thank you for your comprehensive reply. I had another look in what I thought were two Q- hives, only to see a queen running about in one, with drone brood, and fresh drone brood in the other. It appears that I have 2 new queens who have not been able to mate due to 5 weeks of atrocious weather and are sterile. I'll shake both hives out and hope they join the two swarms I captured, which are looking good so far. As my hives are Layens, I haven't worked out a way of physically combining as you would with vertical hives. I shall just hope some bees find their way there,but the numbers are already much reduced.
Many thanks for taking the time to understand my problem, and advise me.

 

[ericbeaumont]

shake both hives out and hope they join the two swarms I captured

I'd remove the duff queens first, just in case.

way of physically combining as you would with vertical hives.

You could make a division board, in effect a larger frame with no beespace, to fit the hive wall-to-floor-to-wall, and tape newspaper to the frame.

 

[Katherine]

I'd remove the duff queens first, just in case.

You could make a division board, in effect a larger frame with no beespace, to fit the hive wall-to-wall, and tape newspaper to the frame.

Ah yes I could. Good idea. Thanks.

 

[BernardBlack]

What would be the advice for re-using frames that were stored in the shed over winter?

Is it advisable or would they need freezing/sterilised or whatever?

 

[Erichalfbee]

What would be the advice for re-using frames that were stored in the shed over winter?

Is it advisable or would they need freezing/sterilised or whatever?

What sort of frames?
I store my super frames wet
Brood frames in freezer if there are uncapped stores or pollen, or in broods in the shed
Don’t sterilise anything

 

[ericbeaumont]

Is it advisable or would they need freezing/sterilised or whatever?

Freezing for 48 hours will kill wax moth and is a useful job in small doses; best buy a chest freezer that can take whole boxes, because comb is brittle when frozen.

Nothing in beekeeping is sterile (not even honey jars) so save your energy.

If frames were stored sealed from access by mice and rats and are not ravaged by wax moth or damp (black mould), then re-use if not too dark.

Large latte dark: two more years. Conker dark: one more year. Liquorice dark: burn or bag and send with the household waste.

If you're keen and time-rich, stick them in a solar melter for several months and salvage a teaspoon of pure wax.

Don't worry if combs have cobwebs or dents: bees will clean and repair.

 

[drex]

I suggest you get a different solar wax melter, if that is your experience.

 

[Amari]

I suggest you get a different solar wax melter, if that is your experience.

Please remind us Drex: what sort of solar wax extractor do you recommend? Rendering black brood combs in my Burco boiler yields zilch.

 

[Antipodes]

Freezing for 48 hours will kill wax moth and is a useful job in small doses; best buy a chest freezer that can take whole boxes, because comb is brittle when frozen.

Nothing in beekeeping is sterile (not even honey jars) so save your energy.

If frames were stored sealed from access by mice and rats and are not ravaged by wax moth or damp (black mould), then re-use if not too dark.

Large latte dark: two more years. Conker dark: one more year. Liquorice dark: burn or bag and send with the household waste.

If you're keen and time-rich, stick them in a solar melter for several months and salvage a teaspoon of pure wax.

Don't worry if combs have cobwebs or dents: bees will clean and repair.

Putting the whole box in also kills and eggs/grubs in the box crevices.

 

[drex]

Please remind us Drex: what sort of solar wax extractor do you recommend? Rendering black brood combs in my Burco boiler yields zilch.

Home made. Polystyrene fish box, sheet of double glazing. Non stick loaf tin to collect wax. Stainless steel baking tray with hole drilled in corner to put the old wax in.
Works a treat. I fill mine up and forget it, as it needs no supervision. Very little labour and time needed.
Over the last year I have collected 7 loaf tins worth, which I will take into Thornes of Windsor on my way to Devon

 

[drex]

Just done the trade in. In the end, I got 9 packs of deep and 3 packs and 3 sheets of shallow. Just paid the re wiring cost which was about £35.
Wonderful saving when you think a pack of deep costs £13.85, and it takes so little effort.

 

[Katherine]

Just done the trade in. In the end, I got 9 packs of deep and 3 packs and 3 sheets of shallow. Just paid the re wiring cost which was about £35.
Wonderful saving when you think a pack of deep costs £13.85, and it takes so little effort.

Good result . I also salvaged my colony,shaking out the drone laying queen. Reserves still not great but resulting combined hive has at least a chance of getting through the winter.