Pseudo scorpion Vs Varroa destructor

[Beecarer]

I recently learned about the Pseudo scorpion and how they coexisted in harmony with the bees before the use of insecticides, open mesh floors etc to control Varroa mite levels. In the most recent edition of 'The Four Seasons' published by the Native Irish Honey Bee Society there is an article written by Ron Hoskins titled 'Varroa-tolerent Honeybees?' makes very interesting reading. He has no colony losses and has not used chemicals on his hives for 20 years. It just seems the more you read and learn about the chemicals we use for the treatment of Varrora they are causing mayhem to the natural order of defense that nature will always provide.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1zdancXRDg

Pseudo scorpion Vs Varroa destructor - Video in the link above

When checking Varroa levels around the solstice just past I had a closer look on what creatures are inhabiting the insert tray and found this little fella tipping about, not quite a Pseudo scorpion but interesting all the same.





Have many people on here decided to go chemical free and instead decided to pay close attention to see which of their colonys are grooming mites and then breed from these colonys?

 

[Hivemaker.]

It just seems the more you read and learn about the chemicals we use for the treatment of Varrora they are causing mayhem to the natural order of defense that nature will always provide.

But nowhere near the mayhem varroa would cause if the chemicals were not used, and varroa is not natural here, humans brought it here.

There have been a few threads about the Pseudo scorpions, here is one of them...http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=23076&highlight=Pseudo+scorpions

 

[Beecarer]

But nowhere near the mayhem varroa would cause if the chemicals were not used, and varroa is not natural here, humans brought it here.

There have been a few threads about the Pseudo scorpions, here is one of them...http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=23076&highlight=Pseudo+scorpions

Thanks for the link, but 20 yrs chemical free and now has bees that coexist with Varroa the mites seem to have traded a non lethal Deformed Wing Virus with the bees in order to coexist, seems the chemical treatments just interfere with nature and the defense mechanisms it will create when under threat.

Heres a link to a recent article about his bees...

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/..._from_a_parasite_causing_a_worldwide_decline/


Hes not advocating complete chemical free bee keeping to start off, if your hive is becoming infested treat it. What he says is we need to be paying closer attention (microscopic level) to all our colonys to find which ones have the ability to groom the mites naturally and in turn breed from these colonys.

 

[Hivemaker.]

seems the chemical treatments just interfere with nature and the defense mechanisms it will create when under threat.

Heres a link to a recent article about his bees...

Stop treating your bees then, see how it goes.... but personally when I have tried the queens from the suppliers of these treatment free bees in various places none of them have been any good against varroa so far.

There have been several threads about Rons bees on here over the years, here are a couple of them...Ron is member Swinbee in the first thread.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=35485&highlight=Ron+hoskins

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=20052&highlight=Ron+hoskins

 

[pargyle]

There are a number of threads on here about non-treatment ... this is one of the more rational ones;

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=34981&highlight=treatment+free

I don't treat my bees and have been treatment free since I got my bees - but I never say never - going treatment free is just a case of stopping treatment - but it's what you do to ensure that your bees are not being overcome by varroa and the diseases they spread that is the important bit.

I don't believe that there are many bees that can be relied upon to be naturally hygienic .. even queens brought in from colonies that do exhibit hygienic traits do not always produce colonies with the same characteristics - it's a bit of a lottery but as long as you are prepared to treat if and when your bees show signs of a heavy infestation then there is no harm in treading a path to the dark side.

I have an OA sublimator and crystals and I would not hesitate to use it if I thought my bees were not coping with the varroa in the hive. It's not an easy road to follow - I'm not a 'let alone' beekeeper - I probably spend more time on my bees as a result of being treatment free than I would if I just treated them ... but .. as HM says - it's your choice - your bees. It is possible but there are risks and you need a bit of luck on your side ... Do you feel lucky ?

 

[Finman]

I recently learned about the Pseudo scorpion and how they coexisted in harmony with the bees before the use of insecticides, open mesh floors etc to control Varroa mite levels. In the most recent edition of 'The Four Seasons' published by the Native Irish Honey Bee Society there is an article written by Ron Hoskins titled 'Varroa-tolerent Honeybees?' makes very interesting reading. He has no colony losses and has not used
?

That is at least 10 years old fairy tale among natural beekeepers.

Bees do not allow all kind of bugs on their brood combs.

Vain hope, that someone comes and save you from mites..

 

[Finman]

.

If these occupy brood combs, do you quess, which is better food for them, bee larvae or mites?

 

[Finman]

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There are many stories about Lion and Lamb. (can somebody help lion!)

 

[Finman]

.
Pseudoscorpion in beehive


Title Pseudoscorpion in beehive
Year of Publication 1908
Authors Merwe, JH
Journal Agricultural Journal of the Cape of Good Hope
Volume 33
Pagination 517-518

 

[user 6228]

Stop treating your bees then, see how it goes.... but personally when I have tried the queens from the suppliers of these treatment free bees in various places none of them have been any good against varroa so far.

There have been several threads about Rons bees on here over the years, here are a couple of them...Ron is member Swinbee in the first thread.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=35485&highlight=Ron+hoskins

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=20052&highlight=Ron+hoskins

The failure after relocation seems to be common in the scientific studies. This is obviously more complicated than A simple genetic trait.

 

[Finman]

.
This text: Several New Zealand entomologists are optimistic, among them Dr. Barry Donovan. He has published several popular and technical articles touting pseudoscorpions as having potential to control Varroa. His evidence is compelling — pseudoscorpions do eat Varroa mites. Video surveillance reveals they will even remove the mites from bee larvae for an easy snack (Fagan et al. 2012).

How in heck these bugs can walk freely on combs? Open pupa cappings and pick up mite nymphs?


What is happening in bee hives!

something worse than varroa....

 

[Karol]

.

If these occupy brood combs, do you quess, which is better food for them, bee larvae or mites?

No idea - don't know enough about the subject. The only observation that I would make is that the claws on the pseudoscorpion appear to be suited to scale shaped insects such as mites rather than tubular shaped prey.

 

[norfolknchance]

research

I recently learned about the Pseudo scorpion and how they coexisted in harmony with the bees before the use of insecticides, open mesh floors etc to control Varroa mite levels. In the most recent edition of 'The Four Seasons' published by the Native Irish Honey Bee Society there is an article written by Ron Hoskins titled 'Varroa-tolerent Honeybees?' makes very interesting reading. He has no colony losses and has not used chemicals on his hives for 20 years. It just seems the more you read and learn about the chemicals we use for the treatment of Varrora they are causing mayhem to the natural order of defense that nature will always provide.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1zdancXRDg

Pseudo scorpion Vs Varroa destructor - Video in the link above

When checking Varroa levels around the solstice just past I had a closer look on what creatures are inhabiting the insert tray and found this little fella tipping about, not quite a Pseudo scorpion but interesting all the same.

View attachment 12624

View attachment 12625

Have many people on here decided to go chemical free and instead decided to pay close attention to see which of their colonys are grooming mites and then breed from these colonys?

Phytoseiulus persimilis is a killer of spider mite I wondered if there was a natural harmless killer like this one that might destroy Varroa JUST A THOUGHT

 

[Finman]

Phytoseiulus persimilis is a killer of spider mite I wondered if there was a natural harmless killer like this one that might destroy Varroa JUST A THOUGHT

During my 53 years in beekeeping, I have never seen pseudo scorpions walking on combs when I have inspected hives. There are small creatures on the floor of beehive, but all are cleaned down, which goes up to bees' combs.

I have had varroa in my hives since 1982. 33 years.
I have had lots of dead hives for varroa. I have never heard that pseudo scorpions have rescued any beehives.

Why pseudo scorpions start at once kill varroa mites, because they have not done it during last 100 years? Should we go to Siberian Primorsk area and pick some false scorpions from there?

Or go to Apis ceranea district where Varroa has been thousands of years and lived with pseudoscorpions?



.

 

[Hivemaker.]

The failure after relocation seems to be common in the scientific studies. This is obviously more complicated than A simple genetic trait.

It is, the varroa also seem to vary a lot.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

an article written by Ron Hoskins titled 'Varroa-tolerent Honeybees?' makes very interesting reading. He has no colony losses and has not used chemicals on his hives for 20 years.

I find that hard to believe whether he uses 'chemicals' or not - realms of fantasy IMHO.
And remember all you 'bee havers' who liberally sprinkle your bees with magic fairy dust - sugar is a chemical as well

 

[pargyle]

I find that hard to believe whether he uses 'chemicals' or not - realms of fantasy IMHO.
And remember all you 'bee havers' who liberally sprinkle your bees with magic fairy dust - sugar is a chemical as well

From what I've heard from Ron he does not claim that he's had no losses - what he has claimed is that he had not had excessive colony losses.

Indeed, I have a local non-treater who has been treatment free now for 10 years - his losses (confirmed as he uses his own apiary as a training apiary) are no more or no less than other members report.

But ... I think there is as much luck as skill involved - there's so much that we don't know about the bee/mite relationship. Finnman is at one end of the spectrum and there are some of us at the other (and quite a few, these days that are in the treatment when needed camp) but there are good indications that some colonies can survive without treatment - and there's quite a few colonies that don't survive with treatment as well.

 

[masterBK]

Most parasites and pathogens introduced to a new host cause devastating effects for several years but it is often the parasite or pathogen that usually becomes adapted to the host so that they both co-exist rather than the host adapting. We are seeing this with the discovery of the milder form of the DWV. Maybe in time we will see Varroa mite only breed in drone brood like it does with its original host or produce less young or become virus free. Difficult to predict the direction natural selection will go but I think it most likely the Mite will adapt and evolve faster than the bee

 

[Finman]

.
IT is so funny to read these beginners texts.

Varroa game to my country 40 years ago. During first 10 years no one had advices what to do that bug. Mite killed apiaries one after another.

But the best, what varroa did, was that it killed all black colonies. IT is much more easier to nurse varroa that black bee.

At least I can say that pest hoast relation did not work.

ACtually varroa is my friend.

 

[BeeJayBee]

Most parasites and pathogens introduced to a new host cause devastating effects for several years but it is often the parasite or pathogen that usually becomes adapted to the host so that they both co-exist rather than the host adapting. We are seeing this with the discovery of the milder form of the DWV. Maybe in time we will see Varroa mite only breed in drone brood like it does with its original host or produce less young or become virus free. Difficult to predict the direction natural selection will go but I think it most likely the Mite will adapt and evolve faster than the bee

with the last sentence. It doesn't do any parasite or any pest any good if the host species is destroyed. Mites have a shorter lifecycle, so should be quicker to adapt to a new host than the bees. But the adaptation will probably only be local, and in time the best adapted will be the ones to survive. If we keep moving bees (and mites) around then we're messing up their chances.