Poaching sites

[Easy Beesy]

Out of interest, what is members opinion of poaching sites? If you know someone has hives within a small nature reserve is it good/bad form to approach the reserve with a view to setting up a branch training apiary within the reserve? Thoughts and/or advice appreciated.
Eb

 

[Bob Bee]

Out of interest, what is members opinion of poaching sites? If you know someone has hives within a small nature reserve is it good/bad form to approach the reserve with a view to setting up a branch training apiary within the reserve? Thoughts and/or advice appreciated.
Eb

Well if your talking "form" or etiquette or manners or neighbourliness, then it speaks for itself. Bad. But there may be a way forward if you approach the Beek first etc.

 

[BeeJayBee]

I think your expression, "Poaching sites", says what you really think about this proposal.

 

[scuttlefish]

I suppose it's always handy to have a poaching site... but (Bob Bee's suggestion about approaching the beek first aside) poaching someone else's site is bang out of order, just not cricket, and a really nasty thing to do.

I'd put that more strongly, but the words I'd normally choose to express my feelings on it aren't family-friendly.

 

[BBG]

They may be trying to establish an area and want 00s of acres for themselves without interference from someone with hives that MIGHT be diseased, get robbed or worse, allow their less desirable drones free reign over a fragile breeding ground.

As forage is pretty sparse in many places, another beekeeper invading the space would not be welcome.

A friend put hives on land that had an orchard nearby only to find that the owner suddenly had a penchant for beekeeping when swarms appeared not far away.

10 hives later for the land owner, some honey was removed - supers left out with frames still wet for bees to clean up - wasps arrived literally by the bucket-load.

He left as wasp attacks went on all day at his hives - the likelihood of disease increased - robbing all round - mayhem.

Second thoughts - Do you want to take the risk of moving your hives close to them?

Some rural areas would find you discovering nothing in your hives or their complete disappearance.

 

[DontWorryBeeHappy]

Reverse the roles, how would you feel if you had established a nice little apiary and smeone else set up close?

I think from the wording of your question you know the answer. Beeks need to work together not against each other.

 

[Easy Beesy]

Beejoyful
I know my opinion but I might be biased - I wanted to know YOUR opinion, which is?

 

[mattsbees]

The same thing has happened to me, I am currently sharing a site which is a nature reserve. The association now keep pushing people that way even though the land owner is in two minds as to whether they want anymore Beekeepers on there.

Problem is people thing it is a free reign dumping ground/ association facility and I have major concerns about the spread of disease.

I approached the land owner myself but the other fellow was arranged through the association.

I just think, well I was good enough to put the leg work in myself, it's harder to move everything now though.

 

[jezd]

I think your expression, "Poaching sites", says what you really think about this proposal.

Bingo well said, the title says it all.

As someone who is being subjected to this type of action (its a long story) I consider those who view this as acceptable behavior to be true low life - I have a long memory.

re BBKA or regional groups - if and when I find out that they or their members are involved, pain will be dealt out.

Also, often some make a case for doing this under the 'for the community' banners, bull, get off you backside and stop being lazy - find your own sites and establish your own relationships.

Ask yourself how you would feel if someone 'poached' your valued apiaries?



PS yes this is a sensitive point at the moment

PPS some associations now have best practice guidelines within their constitutions along the lines of NOT setting up new apiaries within x miles of other member sites, I think Doncaster has this rule but not sure how widespread this is.

 

[Tom Bick]

I don’t think it’s a problem if you contact the nature reserve you can only ask after all.

Personally I don’t think they will go for it as a training apiary involves a lot of people coming and going and perhaps does not benefit a nature reserve other than the bees that they already have.

 

[jezd]

I don’t think it’s a problem if you contact the nature reserve you can only ask after all.

Personally I don’t think they will go for it as a training apiary involves a lot of people coming and going and perhaps does not benefit a nature reserve other than the bees that they already have.

so knowing fully that another person keeps bees on the land (not sure how big the area is) your happy for an organisation/association to then make a better offer to the landowner?

(I am off to sit in a corner, this subject winds me up to much)

 

[Cazza]

Personally I feel it would be morally inappropriate and out of order unless the original site user was happy about the plan. Can't see why they would be though?? I would more than a little ticked off....
Cazza

 

[AnotherNewBee]

Unfortunately the landowner is likely to see it as a purely commercial arrangement. If suitable access can be arranged without damage to the nature reserve I could see him agreeing to whichever is the more profitable, especially if the nature reserve requires funding for its upkeep.

 

[BeeJayBee]

Beejoyful
I know my opinion but I might be biased - I wanted to know YOUR opinion, which is?

My opinion? The original thoughts would be starred out by site software!

I think it's a particularly 'mean' thing to do, and I think it hints of a touch of selfishness, laziness and maybe even envy on the part of those who think it's a good idea to 'poach' another beekeeper's apiary site, it doesn't matter where it is.

Dressing it up, as in this instance, as 'educational' or 'for training' doesn't mean a lot when, in reality, it's more than likely to be run by an apiary manager who chooses when, and if, others are allowed to visit it. It could, maybe, be chosen as an isolation apiary where swarms are kept to assess their disease load - because looking for signs of disease is 'educational', isn't it?

Also, knowing somebody who runs a nature reserve, I also know their opinion about encouraging 'traffic' to their site, other than bona fide walkers, wildlife group members and wildlife or conservation volunteers. One or two hives might be okay, but an organised teaching apiary isn't likely to be small. It needs vehicle access, to service the hives, and might even need a flat surface for those with mobility issues. As a minimum it's likely to have a well worn path or track to it. All this means it will attract attention, and possibly the wrong sort of attention, with a knock-on effect on the rest of the site and for the local wildlife - which is the reserve's job to protect.

 

[AnotherNewBee]

Also, knowing somebody who runs a nature reserve, I also know their opinion about encouraging 'traffic' to their site, other than bona fide walkers, wildlife group members and wildlife or conservation volunteers. One or two hives might be okay, but an organised teaching apiary isn't likely to be small. It needs vehicle access, to service the hives, and might even need a flat surface for those with mobility issues. As a minimum it's likely to have a well worn path or track to it. All this means it will attract attention, and possibly the wrong sort of attention, with a knock-on effect on the rest of the site and for the local wildlife - which is the reserve's job to protect.

Would planning permission be needed if the traffic is likely to be significant and parking/access might need to be created? If so, that might be enough to put a stop to it.

 

[Easy Beesy]

The idea of the branch using the reserve is because it already has access and parking.
Eb

 

[Bad Boy Bee]

Name and shame! It's the only way this sort of behaviour will be discouraged.

 

[richardbees]

Eb

You already know it's wrong by your thread title....do the decent thing and discuss it with the existing beek first.

rich

 

[Tom Bick]

so knowing fully that another person keeps bees on the land (not sure how big the area is) your happy for an organisation/association to then make a better offer to the landowner?

(I am off to sit in a corner, this subject winds me up to much)

I don’t think it will be a better offer as I point out in my 2nd paragraph.

If it was me I would be a bit miffed but and I don’t expect a 100% guarantee right to stay on the sites I have right now and know it is down to the landowners decision who stays and goes.

A moral dilemma does exist.

 

[richardbees]

a moral dilemma does exist.

No it doesn't Tom. If the existing beek disagrees to sharing the site, the OP can then go direct to the 'owner'