Oxalic and Temperatures

[SteveJ]

Planning on doing my Oxalic treatments over the Christmas period. Is there a minimum temperature I can apply it to the bees?

SteveJ

 

[For want of a better word]

Seems to be a requirement of lack of brood to have any useful outcome... therefore a week or so of cold weather seems to be needed before treatment by trickle!

 

[oliver90owner]

Think about it. The minimum temperature at the outside of the cluster must be around or over 8 Celsius (bees cannot survive for long if their temperature drops below), so above the cluster it should be higher than that.

Keeping that in mind, would indicate that the oxalic needs to be reasonably above that temperature - normal room temp is generally recommended. So not sure what the minimum temperature might be, certainly not less than say 10 degrees Celsius, I would think.

Did that answer your question?

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

Think about it. The minimum temperature at the outside of the cluster must be around or over 8 Celsius (bees cannot survive for long if their temperature drops below), so above the cluster it should be higher than that.

Keeping that in mind, would indicate that the oxalic needs to be reasonably above that temperature - normal room temp is generally recommended. So not sure what the minimum temperature might be, certainly not less than say 10 degrees Celsius, I would think.

Did that answer your question?

Question a bit ambiguous as I took it to mean whats the minimum outside temperature rather than the liquid temperature.

OP?

 

[SteveJ]

I'm thinking atmospheric temp. Don't want to chill the bees.

 

[OXFORDBEE]

A nice little summary can be found here:

http://www.fifebeekeepers.co.uk/Oxalic%20Guidelines.pdf

I don't use trickle treatments but that's another story....

 

[Monsieur Abeille]

Interesting - fifebeeks suggest 5-8 degrees, I've seen elsewhere recommendations that around or below freezing (though not too far) is best to ensure they are tightly clustered.

They also suggest November/December which seems a good month earlier than most suggest - because of their location perhaps? Appreciate that actual dates are misleading and the weather pattern will be a better guide.

 

[moby]

Th***es suggest above 3 degrees

 

[OXFORDBEE]

Interesting - fifebeeks suggest 5-8 degrees, I've seen elsewhere recommendations that around or below freezing (though not too far) is best to ensure they are tightly clustered.

They also suggest November/December which seems a good month earlier than most suggest - because of their location perhaps? Appreciate that actual dates are misleading and the weather pattern will be a better guide.

Below freezing sounds a little odd.

A good resource for oxalic acid treatments can be found at the Swiss Dairy Research Institute.

 

[oliver90owner]

I would think it might just have something to do with the conditions far more than those stupid specific dates posted.

Think about it. A polyhive with no OMF and a strong colony will maintain a considerably higher internal temperature than a weaker colony in an uninsulated timber hive with OMF and the dreaded matchsticks under the crownboard (or holes left open in the crownboard). Any cooling of the cluster would be reversed in a much shorter time-scale with the poly.

The wind-chill factor can have an effect far in excess of opening the crownboard for perhaps less than a minute on a colder day with no wind. Anyone setting minimums or maximums needs to get into the real world and consider the job on the merits of the individual scenarios, available window, etc.

To be honest, the temp of the oxalic is likely to have a bigger effect and the rest is fairly variable. Just do it on an average winter's day.

 

[For want of a better word]

I would think it might just have something to do with the conditions far more than those stupid specific dates posted.

Think about it. A polyhive with no OMF and a strong colony will maintain a considerably higher internal temperature than a weaker colony in an uninsulated timber hive with OMF and the dreaded matchsticks under the crownboard (or holes left open in the crownboard). Any cooling of the cluster would be reversed in a much shorter time-scale with the poly.

The wind-chill factor can have an effect far in excess of opening the crownboard for perhaps less than a minute on a colder day with no wind. Anyone setting minimums or maximums needs to get into the real world and consider the job on the merits of the individual scenarios, available window, etc.

To be honest, the temp of the oxalic is likely to have a bigger effect and the rest is fairly variable. Just do it on an average winter's day.

Make sure the Oxallic acid solution is at room temp!
Personally to open up a hive when the balls are being frozen to the brass monkey is a totally stupid thing to do!

And that has nothing to do whatsoever with a zinc and copper alloy or a lower primate!​

 

[oliver90owner]

when the balls are being frozen to the brass monkey

They didn't get frozen to it - they fell off due to differential expansion (or contraction)

 

[kevboab]

Our association owns a varrox vapouriser which I used for the first time this winter. No messing around with liquids and opening up colonies. Seal up entrance and insert beneath mesh floor from behind made this varroa treatment a doddle.

 

[For want of a better word]

Our association owns a varrox vapouriser which I used for the first time this winter. No messing around with liquids and opening up colonies. Seal up entrance and insert beneath mesh floor from behind made this varroa treatment a doddle.

At Last
HUZAH !​

!

​

 

[Davelin]

.....Just do it on an average winter's day.

From experience of winters in both Lincolnshire and Somerset I would suggest there is a marked difference in the average for those two places!

 

[oldsalthouse]

I will be using the vapouriser this year..

 

[Finman]

.
0C to +5C are good temperatures for trickling.
You need not to wory that your hives catch cold.

First your law book prevented trickling and now hard winter!

About vaporizing: it is not enough that UK comes 10 years after the rest of Europe. Some want to be 20 years behind.

 

[Midland Beek]

Interesting - fifebeeks suggest 5-8 degrees, I've seen elsewhere recommendations that around or below freezing (though not too far) is best to ensure they are tightly clustered..

The colder the better. You want tightly clustered bees - the syrup works over the cluster and over a timescale of weeks it kills the mites.

Trickle on a warm and flying days and how many bees is it going to contact with? Not many.

 

[OXFORDBEE]

About vaporizing: it is not enough that UK comes 10 years after the rest of Europe. Some want to be 20 years behind.

What's wrong with vaporizing?

 

[Finman]

The colder the better. You want tightly clustered bees - the syrup works over the cluster and over a timescale of weeks it kills the mites.

Trickle on a warm and flying days and how many bees is it going to contact with? Not many.

Nanetti says that the warmer the better dead rate. Bees move and spread the stuff.

Cold means that bees have winter rest and they have brood break.
Brood break is the key to succes.

When you trickle, during a minute cluster breaks and it rises the heat.