Newbee question

[For want of a better word]

I have been approached by a local farmer who is going to sow 10 acres of Oil Seed Rape in the Middle Tamar Valley and has asked if I could supply pollinator hives for him next year?

Pretty much I have considered ORS to be more of a nuisance than a major crop.

Does the general 3 mile rule apply.. or will the bees be so engorged with a superflow not even consider flying home?
How many colonies per acre... for how long?
How often and how quickly will the supers need spinning off.
Should I label the jarred honey as for cooking only... or something else OSR honey?
Will it granulate readily in the jar.. if so is it better made into set honey?

What is it worth?

Complete novice!

 

[oliver90owner]

All about 100% wrong.

Far better for hives to be on station - shorter the flying time, more collected. More pollination, too - although OSR is around 90% self pollinating anyway.

Umpteen per acre (well, hectare) as the crop is huge but relatively short lived. They will likely need moving soon after the crop starts to go beyond the flowering stage.

One spinning may well be enough in a normal season (not the last two!) It might depend on the weather and the strength of the colony.

Label it as whatever you please. It will not affect the honey one iota. But do not jar it, is my advice.

I sieve mine into 10l buckets and allow it to granulate. I can then deal with it at relative leisure. It can be soft set, allowed to make a coarse soft set (yummy if you like that slightly gritty texture), blended with other honey types or however you might like your honey. Left to granulate a second time may take much longer than the inital setting in the bucket and can be consumed as runny honey, although granulation may set in as LARGE crystals.

From someone with OSR within reach of the bees every year. It has been a nuisance these last two seasons as the weather in 2012 was so poor and the crop was so late this year (coupled with the colony development being slow) has led to too much OSR in the hives at cropping time. I can cope with it easily - just leave it on the hives - but the bee farmers will have had to work that much harder to avoid this.

 

[TryingToLetThemBee]

How can questions be wrong?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

How can questions be wrong?

It may result in getting the wrong answers?

 

[For want of a better word]

How can questions be wrong?

Tractor Man likes to intimidate !...

But is in a very good position to comment on OSR

Getting the colonies ON STATION ready for the flow would mean a bit of prep in taking colonies to an out apiary 3miles away and then back to the OSR well in advance, and then reversing movement after to get them back to my main apiary... a good 25 mile round trip each time as Cornish Roads to not go directly from A to B, but usually via N and Z ! ( Lack of Romans!)

I guess plonking a colony in the middle of a field of OSR in full flow would not cut the mustard!

( people in these parts seem to think the OSR is mustard!)

 

[For want of a better word]

It may result in getting the wrong answers?

If you ask the wrong questions ... you get the wrong answers
!​

​

 

[itma]

If you ask the wrong questions ... you get the wrong answers
!​

​

As Sir Michael Phillip ("Mick") sang so memorably

You can't always get what you want
But you know sometimes -
You just might find -
You get what you ne-eed

 

[Little John]

Tractor Man likes to intimidate !...

But is in a very good position to comment on OSR

Oh really ? Then why - when I mentioned exactly the same scenario last year I was scathingly told that the farmer concerned was talking b#ll#cks ?

Sheer force of argument and caustic put-downs are no substitute for knowledge.

At the risk of repeating myself, Syngenta have invested 1 million Euros in Operation Pollinator, and for benefit of the cynics it doesn't appear to be only a PR exercise - although I have no doubt that is part of the story.

There is also a very real hard-nosed business element:

Introducing the oilseed rape pollination services field study at Cereals 2011, Syngenta Crop Protection Oilseed Rape Manager, Gary Jobling, said: "Whilst oilseed rape is generally recognised as being self-fertile, studies have shown that insect pollination can increase both seed yield and seed quality.

"There is also evidence from studies in France that efficient pollination could increase the evenness of pod set, which would improve canopy structure for crop management. We have to look at all these factors in developing Integrated Crop Solutions that could help to drive forward oilseed rape yields."

LJ

 

[islayhawk]

:

Getting the colonies ON STATION ready for the flow would mean a bit of prep in taking colonies to an out apiary 3miles away and then back to the OSR well in advance

Another newbee question :- when moving the colony to a new site more than 3 miles, then back to the OSR how long should they be left at the intermediate site before moving to the OSR

islayhawk

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Another newbee question :- when moving the colony to a new site more than 3 miles, then back to the OSR how long should they be left at the intermediate site before moving to the OSR

islayhawk

Depending on forage at the site, but you want all the foraging bees from the original site to die off to change the 'hive memory' to the new site.
I think as well we should go back to the 'rule of thumb' principle. The basis of the three mile rule is that foraging bees don't stumble upon on of the sites they frequented when at the old location which would make them revert to the old location as 'home' Thus you could say that a mile and a half is the foraging radius
if there was ready and plentiful forage nearby the new hive site and the immediate location wasn't well within their old foraging site(i.e. more than 1.5 miles) you may get away with it.

 

[oliver90owner]

How can questions be wrong

Perhaps you need to read the OP AGAIN. Better this time?

Pollination of OSR. Very limited advantage. Think about it.

Added. Syngenta very likely have an ulterior motive. No figures quoted, just ifs and maybes.

Nuisance crop. Wrong again. Any crop for the bees has to be good.

Not a major crop. Really?

3 mile rule. All we know is that it is local. No actual distances, topology, times of moving colonies.

Good, ennit, when you actually realise what is in the post?

Would you like some of the other questions analysed for sensibility or appropriateness?

At least I answered and did not just sit on the sidelines and snipe. Think about that, too.

 

[itma]

...
Pretty much I have considered ORS to be more of a nuisance than a major crop.
...

Perhaps you need to read the OP AGAIN. Better this time?
...
Not a major crop. Really?
...

I know that in some parts, OSR is the major crop.
But that isn't universally so.
Here in town, I don't seem to see any of it. And a small 'contamination' of my runny honey with a little OSR would indeed be a nuisance.

I don't see why other folks different situations should be regarded as being any sort of an error. We may not all be 'lucky' enough to live in an OSR area, but our good fortune comes in different guises!

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

We may not all be 'lucky' enough to live in an OSR area, but our good fortune comes in different guises!

I don't think I would want the modern equivalent to whale oil growing rearby anyway. Bumper crops or not

 

[IBeeHere]

OSR is a blessing and a curse, if the temperature is right (23 + degrees C ) it can produce a lot of nectar, remember this is an early crop so these temperatures may not happen. The pollen is high in protein around 25% and will help rapid build up of colonies, however after a few weeks on the rape beekeepers often note "rape fever" when normally calm bees become unusually aggressive, this can happen also when they are removed from the rape or when it finishes flowering.
Extraction should take place straight after flowering or if left too long it will set in the comb, wet supers replaced back to the hive will often make the next honey crop cristalise in the comb as well.
Ask the farmer when he intends to spray for pollen beetle, which will be during the flowering period, and close the bees in untill the chemical has dried on the crop, or you will suffer potentially huge bee losses due to the chemical.
You should aim for 2 or 3 hives per acre, remove supers after flowering and unless there is another pollen source nearby remove hives soon after flowering.
It will set quite rapidly so place into buckets before processing, the taste is quite mild but some people with allergies request it to help with their symptoms, on need to label it as cooking honey, and within this forum is a good thread on creaming the honey to sell as soft set.

 

[For want of a better word]

Thanks IBH...

When would you expect the OSR to start flowering... remembering the Tamar Valley can have a sub tropical climate... if the wind is in the right direction!
I am certainly looking forward to working with the farmer to see if he can get a worthwhile yeald of OSR for his ( and the bees) efforts.

 

[IBeeHere]

Tamar valley in a "normal" season latter part of April to May start but will vary even from field to field slightly.

 

[Amari]

I have been approached by a local farmer who is going to sow 10 acres of Oil Seed Rape in the Middle Tamar Valley and has asked if I could supply pollinator hives for him next year?

Pretty much I have considered ORS to be more of a nuisance than a major crop.

Does the general 3 mile rule apply.. or will the bees be so engorged with a superflow not even consider flying home?
How many colonies per acre... for how long?
How often and how quickly will the supers need spinning off.
Should I label the jarred honey as for cooking only... or something else OSR honey?
Will it granulate readily in the jar.. if so is it better made into set honey?

What is it worth?

Complete novice!

It continues to amaze me how contradictory advice on the forum is!
My 7 hives are near OSR. Wonderful crop every year! I usually extract late April and mid May (3 weeks later this year). Goes straight into jars. Texture always excellent = creamy, without any manipulation.
Now the most important point: I often ask regular customers whether they prefer 'spring honey' or 'summer honey' (I usually put both in the tupperware box outside the hedge with list of blossom sources) and more than half (mind you, this is Suffolk) prefer 'spring'. I also use OSR honey to 'seed' summer honey in the settling tank to give a better texture. Price the same whatever source, £3.50 this year, £4 next year

 

[For want of a better word]

It continues to amaze me how contradictory advice on the forum is!
My 7 hives are near OSR. Wonderful crop every year! I usually extract late April and mid May (3 weeks later this year). Goes straight into jars. Texture always excellent = creamy, without any manipulation.
Now the most important point: I often ask regular customers whether they prefer 'spring honey' or 'summer honey' (I usually put both in the tupperware box outside the hedge with list of blossom sources) and more than half (mind you, this is Suffolk) prefer 'spring'. I also use OSR honey to 'seed' summer honey in the settling tank to give a better texture. Price the same whatever source, £3.50 this year, £4 next year

Is that per ounce?

£10.00 per lb here!

 

[Amari]

Is that per ounce?

£10.00 per lb here!

Ah, but maybe you only get a few lbs of honey a year down there in that there Tamar. Put your hives on OSR and the honey will flow so quickly that you will beg folk to take it off you @ £3.50.

 

[richardbees]

Nuisance crop. Wrong again. Any crop for the bees has to be good

Oliver

imho that is such an aggressive post, have you tried anusol?

- I also wouldn't like a small patch of osr in my bees' foraging area

richard