Neopoll

[HM Honey]

I don't know whether or not the figures quoted by Sipa are accurate or plucked from thin air? I have never seen any figures for Neopoll so cant dispute them really. The research that Chrisfnvs quotes appears to indicate that Neopoll provides at the very least, a boost for the bees.

My own opinion (for what its worth) after speaking to people at my association who have used Neopoll for some time, is that it gets the bees going so to speak and gives them a small boost of protein/pollen to at least put the queen in the "right frame of mind". Some have even said that it has put their bees a month in front of the norm (whatever the norm is).

I'm going to give it a go this year and have now decided to feed all four colonies. It may turn out to be wasted money and as I'm going to do all four colonies, I may never truly know the effect. All I can do is compare to the build up I got last year and make a rough decision after that. And yes, I know....other influences blah blah blah...

I'm not a commercial beek and don't mind spending £100 or so to "give it a go and see what happens". This year is going to be my "experimenting year" I think.

Things like....Rose hive Method, three shallows as a brood area, no Queen restrictors, Demery method of swarm control, rearing my own queens etc etc etc....

 

[Ginger19]

HM, I also have 4 hives - you mentioned £100 does this mean they will need a good few packs of the stuff in succession? I had wondered about doing it, but it's guess work for me and my guess was add 1 pack per hive to give them a head start = £20.

 

[HM Honey]

Hi Ginger19

The £100 was just a figure plucked from the air tbh. I am just intending to buy enough to ensure that once I start, I can continue it until there is a good flow of pollen coming in. As per Oliver's post above, I don't trust or believe the figures quoted previously but as I said, I don't mind spending £100 or so to give it a go.

It's an experiment, a trial as such.

All I would say is that if it does work, and it does encourage early brooding, then if you don't have much pollen coming in at the moment (as I don't), then you need to ensure that you can keep them supplied until the pollen does start coming in. I don't think it would be good for them to put it on for 2 weeks and then stop. If she does lay loads of brood and then suddenly doesn't have any protein coming in, I cant imagine this would be good or helpful.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

I have put a pack of Neopol on one of my hives to see for myself whether it's useful or just marketed well. As with any advertising a healthy dose of cynicism is required!
The same goes for opinions broadcast on here!

 

[Hivemaker.]

RAB...Sipa removed some of of your posts, inbox box was starting to fill up with complaints....please continue in a more friendly manner.



Edit.......

Just a note of caution before you smash open the piggy...............

A friend of mines fed 500 hives with Neopol this spring, all the time until the rape was on the go. Spent a lot of money on it, bought in pallet load amounts.

Advantage over the non fed hives was precisely zero. Serious pollen dearths in the UK are not common.

 

[HM Honey]

You see, this is what I love about bee keeping. just on this subject we have two beeks, both qouting totally opposite outcomes where other beeks "that they know" have tried the product....lol

One shows compelling evidence for it, the other show compelling evidence against it.....

I guess that backs up RAB's notion that you use advice on this forum with a pinch a salt....

In case anyone's interested, I will comment on my observations after using the product.

 

[Tom Bick]

I am a lucky chap as I am baby sitting a tbh and it's positioned facing my small workshop and boy the last thing the girls need right now is a supplement as they are packing in the real stuff at an alarming rate. If you are in an area with little or no pollen right now don't worry it will happen and the bees will respond. As hobby beekeepers we should not think of our bees as a production line and let a more natural pace be determined by local conditions.

 

[oliver90owner]

One shows compelling evidence for it, the other show compelling evidence against it.....

HM,

Can you confirm that I am not included the above quote, please?

I don't believe I did anything other than ask, even demand, evidence of a figure which was likely clutched
from the air.

No compelling evidence from me, just making the point that IF the bees already have sufficient stored carbohydrate and protein (along with sufficient water supplies, of course) I would not add fancy expensive supplements just because they are there and advertised heavily.

Had the evidence been provided, rather than the poster repeatedly attempting to deflect the post away from the real facts, I would have been quite happy. I accept verifiable truth but not bovine excrement.

As you likely worked out - due to the absence of any firm evidence and the way in which the poster was attempting to avoid admitting there was no evidence of a 33% increase -I was, once again, uncovering the real value of the information contained in that post.

RAB

 

[Tom Bick]

Your like a dog with a bone rab

 

[Swarm]

More like a shovel being scraped on the road.

 

[sipa]

Go figure ??

 

[HM Honey]

One shows compelling evidence for it, the other show compelling evidence against it.....

HM

Can you confirm that I am not included the above quote, please?

RAB

Hi RAB

I can indeed confirm I wasn't referring to any of your posts. I was referring in particular to the post by chrisfnvs at #30 and the contradicting one by Hivemaker at #45 (he was quoting Into the Lions Den). Both appear to be able to draw on good trials of the stuff and yet both give opposite results?

I, like you, don't believe the figures being quoted as after searching myself, can not find ANY info to support them. SIPA may very well be quoting from experience, I don't know. I also don't know enough (or anything really) about Neopoll to be able to dispute his figures, I just don't intend to base my behaviour on them.

 

[Finman]

.
When bees rear one frame of brood, they need one frame pollen to do that.
Bees need essential amino acids, vitamins etc to make food juice to larvae.
A larva grows 1000 times big in 5 days.
Then when emerged, the bee consumes quite a lot pollen to finish its growth.

So, the colony needs real pollen all the time. If pollen is finish in the hive, bees stop larva feeding and they eate away their larvae. They start again larva feeding when they get pollen from nature.

During normal spring build up bees eate part of larvae and that is why the brood area is porous.
When well feeded with patty , brood area is very even with some holes. Colony needs good pollen stores to go over bad weeks when they cannot fly to flowers.

All these were cleared out 1953 By Dr. A. De Groot in Germany.

I have only 23 years experience about spring feeding. Sugar I have feeded 50 years, and I can say that sugar feeding does not add brood in the hive. They need protein.

It is vain hope that colony grows with blessed sugar. If they make 6 frames brood, they must get from somewhere 6 frames of pollen. It is much work, and no colony has such amount of pollen stores in the hive after winter, and not even in autumn.

http://www.honeybee.com.au/Library/pollen/nutrition.html

If the colony has nosema, workers gut is spoiled and such hive is very slow to start spring build up. You may help such hive when you take an emerging frame of brood from big healthy hive.
.

.

 

[Chrisfnvs]

I think the posts show it is a matter of choice in the end, some like it and some don't, i find it useful as i said as a boost for OSR colonies that are a little behind in strength at a particular time, i only use one block on each unless the weather turns then maybe more but usually not, i always keep a close eye on stores and income especially pollen, this give a couple of extra frames of brood when i need it, i certainly will not be spending hundreds of pounds on it, this is what works for me on specific colonies at a specific time, i guess you pay your money etc.

 

[HM Honey]

Thanks for the reply Finman but the debate is about whether Neopoll can encourage brood, not sugar. Have you aver used Neopoll? Do you have any experience of that?

 

[Finman]

Thanks for the reply Finman but the debate is about whether Neopoll can encourage brood, not sugar. Have you aver used Neopoll? Do you have any experience of that?

I know because I can read. ...It was said that Neopol has some secret agent which inspire (= blessed sugar) brooding, but as I wrote, feeding juice does not become from nothing.

As far as I know, Neopoll has very few protein. What I have read, it has only 2%. Perhaps no one knows. what it is.....BUt if you dilute the sugar away, you will see what is left from the stuff.

I have no experience about neopoll because I have done my own patties, which is well known in forum. Patty must allways have 50% sugar that it does not ferment. But it should have over 20% protein.

 

[Cazza]

I think the posts show it is a matter of choice in the end, some like it and some don't, i find it useful as i said as a boost for OSR colonies that are a little behind in strength at a particular time, i only use one block on each unless the weather turns then maybe more but usually not, i always keep a close eye on stores and income especially pollen, this give a couple of extra frames of brood when i need it, i certainly will not be spending hundreds of pounds on it, this is what works for me on specific colonies at a specific time, i guess you pay your money etc.

Cazza

 

[Finman]

.
Value of opinions

Most of beekeepers agree that light syrup feeding boosts spring build up. The science says, it does not.

Most of beekeepers say that protein feeding does not help in spring build up. They say that natural build up is as good. Science says controversy.

I must say that I have not got better early yields during my 20 years feeding, because weathers are too cold to bees. Bees need over 20C temps that they get real yields.

But protein feeding gives me very strong hives and masses of bees for main yield. Our main yield starts with raspberry blooming at the end of June, and for that larvae are reared 1,5 months earlier. With strong hives I can help small colonies to achieve ready to foraging state.

Sometimes we have in May 2 weeks rain and even 3 weeks rain, and natural hives stop brood rearing then. With patty feeding my hives continue brood rearing with 50% efficacy.

What is yield...To me yield is 60 - 80 kg.
40 kg per hive is to me disappoinment. Climate, climate, climate....I have learned best feeding advices from Australia, from Egypt and from USA. That knowledge from different climates has worked splended in my climate, even if we have snow in the ground and nothing is blooming. Very few countries have made nutrition researching, ...or beekeeping research at all.



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[Finman]

.
Heather Mattila's evaluation about spring protein feeding.

She is now a professor in beekeeping. http://www.wellesley.edu/biology/faculty/mattilah

http://www.globalpatties.com/pages/articles/nutrition.htm


Mattila: "Colonies that had pollen supplements in early spring produced two to four times more brood than control and pollen restricted colonies, respectively, and only supplemented colonies reared brood in significant amounts before natural pollen foraging began."

Finman's experiences: Protein feeding works only in big hives. Small colonies become sick. They get chalkbrood (2-4 frames of bees) . I can help small when I put to them emerging brood frames.

 

[Finman]

.
About Neopoll.

I cannot find from internet any sing about protein content of Neopoll.

In Finland Neopoll price is 6 euros/kg. In Germany it is 4 €/kg.

Irradiated pollen is about 12€/kg. According pollen price Neopoll has not much.

But dilute sugar away with hot water and sieve the stuff via coffee sieve paper, and you see what is in there.

Natural pollen which comes to the hive has about 30% honey.