Linseed Oil for treating Hives?

[BernardBlack]

I know Linseed Oil is used for treating hurls and cricket bats.

Just wondered if it would be good enough to treat Hives (cedar) ... and hive stands ?

I have new Brood boxes, supers, and some hive stands that I’ve made, ready to be treated for the first time.

 

[RichardK]

I use it on some of my hives - realistically it needs reapplying each year though. As I understand it, does offer reasonable protection over the long term as long as you keep on top of it.

 

[HughMann]

The only downside is, it does not look as nice as you first think it will look. After a few onths it goes a bit great. Really does the job though if you put it on when it is hot. Try in winter and it will take forever to dry

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Just wondered if it would be good enough to treat Hives (cedar)

Cedar doesn't need treating with anything

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

As I understand it, does offer reasonable protection over the long term as long as you keep on top of it.

But cedar doesn't need any extra 'reasonable protection' it's weatherproof as it is - for the 'long term' as well

 

[blackcloud]

Cedar doesn't need treating with anything

A nice card and a box of chocolates every now and then never goes amiss?

I use it a lot -there is an internet perpetuated opinion you should only use raw on beehives as boiled is poisonous.
Boiled oil dries differently but the occasions I've used it have given zero adverse effect on the bees-you don't put any oil type on the entrance anyway.

 

[ericbeaumont]

boiled is poisonous.

See the pdf which states that Boiled Linseed Oils are produced from Linseed Oil using one or more metallic siccatives to give a range of oils with varying colours and drying
times.

Then there's this: some of the petroleum-based siccative compounds that are added to linseed oil to decrease the drying time are naptha, mineral spirits, and dipropylene glycol monomethyl. Cobalt and manganese are the most common metal siccatives found in boiled linseed oil.

 

[RichardK]

But cedar doesn't need any extra 'reasonable protection' it's weatherproof as it is - for the 'long term' as well

Correct. Upon reflection I didn't really answer the original question.

@BernardBlack - yes linseed oil is good enough / perfectly suitable for treating cedar hives and stands. It's a pretty impressive wood if you care to read up about it. It's resistant to rot and decay and also offers a natural resistance to bugs trying to bore into it or whatever. It apparently has a certain smell to it which insects don't like & naturally contains a chemical called Thujone (Red Cedar doesn't) which causes nerve damage to any insects foolhardy enough to try and mess around with it. I expected it to be a hardwood, whereas in fact it's a softwood.... albeit it a very strong one. Life expectancy - 20'ish years.

If you don't treat it, it will naturally weather over time and turn a silvery / grey'ish colour. How long will this take? It's all to do with the amount of sunshine it's exposed to, however, it could be as little as 6 to 12 months in a sunny location. Treatment will extent it’s life, however, at 20 years do you really care? For me, treating with with linseed oil is about aesthetics and personal choice. For example I also paint some of my hives and accept that from time to time I’ll have to do it again – or maybe change for a different colour. However, I like them like that and having only a handful of hives means I can. As @blackcloud said: “A nice card and a box of chocolates every now and then never goes amiss?“

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I expected it to be a hardwood, whereas in fact it's a softwood

One of the hardest woods (lignum vitae) so dense it sinks, is a softwood, whilst balsa is in fact a hardwood
Many people make this mistake of thinking hard/soft wood has to do with how hard or soft the wood is. it's simpler than that. Softwoods are gymnosperms (revealed seeds, ie cones) such as conifers whist hardwoods are angiosperms which have seeds concealed within fruit such as broad leaved trees

 

[ericbeaumont]

Life expectancy - 20'ish years.

Twenty or so years ago we were pruning in an abandoned Kent orchard - great memories of two days up a vast Bramley during a week of constant snow - and in the undergrowth found a few dead hives.

Most were too far gone but I pulled out an unmodified National cedar super and took it home. It needed a scorch, a couple of small repairs and a scrub in soda before being put to use.

Must have been 50 years old at least when I found it, and it's on a hive now, but in its long and solid life it has had no wood treatment of any kind.

For me, treating with with linseed oil is about aesthetic

You will discover that after a while the oil will turn black as moulds take hold.

When I went down this road I washed the boxes in hot soda and resolved never again to waste time and money on unnecessary jobs.

 

[RichardK]

One of the hardest woods (lignum vitae) so dense it sinks, is a softwood, whilst balsa is in fact a hardwood
Many people make this mistake of thinking hard/soft wood has to do with how hard or soft the wood is. it's simpler than that. Softwoods are gymnosperms (revealed seeds, ie cones) such as conifers whist hardwoods are angiosperms which have seeds concealed within fruit such as broad leaved trees

Whilst not something you’re likely to find growing in the UK, lignum vitae is interesting to read about. It is actually classified as a hardwood though (it’s seeds are indeed encased in a shell). The Wood Database

 

[RichardK]

Twenty or so years ago we were pruning in an abandoned Kent orchard - great memories of two days up a vast Bramley during a week of constant snow - and in the undergrowth found a few dead hives.

Most were too far gone but I pulled out an unmodified National cedar super and took it home. It needed a scorch, a couple of small repairs and a scrub in soda before being put to use.

Must have been 50 years old at least when I found it, and it's on a hive now, but in its long and solid life it has had no wood treatment of any kind.


You will discover that after a while the oil will turn black as moulds take hold.

When I went down this road I washed the boxes in hot soda and resolved never again to waste time and money on unnecessary jobs.

That is amazing! Durability really is relative to the environment - the 20 years figure is I'd say a generally accepted one from the internet, but of course there will be things that last longer given the right conditions (as per your example). Northern Ireland is I imagine somewhat wetter than Kent so the OP may not be so lucky. Personally I still think (only...) 20 years is pretty amazing.

Mould doesn't tend to be a problem where I live as it's too dry. I have 4 year old raised beds made from cheap scaffolding planks (pine) with minimal signs of rot (I can't see any, but there must be some if I chose to really look). All they had was one coat of linseed oil at the start.

I only have 8 hives compared to your 70, and they are in my garden. I take pleasure in how my apiary & hives look as I see it many times every day and so I don't regard it as wasted time or money. I don't like cutting the grass, but I do it as it looks so much better.....same argument really.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

lignum vitae is interesting to read about. It is actually classified as a hardwood though (it’s seeds are indeed encased in a shell)

when I was learning it was classed as a softwood. Amazing stuff, used a bearings/glands on screw propeller shafts as it was self lubricating

 

[ericbeaumont]

I don't like cutting the grass, but I do it as it looks so much better.

I could spend several days and a few hundred pounds on plants, dig in a couple of tons of compost, prune this and that and the client would be only mildly satisfied.

Different reaction if I'd also cut the grass: they'd coo over the work and pay up with pleasure.

 

[RichardK]

when I was learning it was classed as a softwood. Amazing stuff, used a bearings/glands on screw propeller shafts as it was self lubricating

I completely agree - unbelievable that wood can be used for such applications.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I completely agree - unbelievable that wood can be used for such applications.

used a lot for sheaves in blocks in rigging etc, and also policeman's truncheons. Us in the Senior Service weren't allowed truncheons but used to be issued with old fashioned cylindrical 12" rulers for our boarding cases - made from Lingum Vitae!!

 

[RichardK]

I could spend several days and a few hundred pounds on plants, dig in a couple of tons of compost, prune this and that and the client would be only mildly satisfied.

Different reaction if I'd also cut the grass: they'd coo over the work and pay up with pleasure.

I was chatting to a landscape gardener friend here last week & he recounted a conversation he'd recently had with a client. The client felt his invoice was a little expensive. He said that from his side, with the amount he and his team has sweated doing the work he felt the price was more than fair. He then asked his client (who owns & runs a vineyard) that if he purchased some of his bottles of wine and subsequently said that he felt they were expensive what would he think? He replied that he would have to disagree. He then paid the invoice with no further debate.

People don't always see / appreciate value in the same way.

 

[JamezF]

As far as I recall, John Harrison's first marine chronometer, which had to be sufficiently accurate to allow navigators to determine their longitude (that was the point of it, after all) had a movement made of wood, largely because he was a carpenter and understood how to work it.

James

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

As far as I recall, John Harrison's first marine chronometer, which had to be sufficiently accurate to allow navigators to determine their longitude (that was the point of it, after all) had a movement made of wood, largely because he was a carpenter and understood how to work it.

I think that may have been the first 'ordinary' clock he built which was sited in a tower on top of a stable block, I'm sure his 'watches' were all (or mainly) metal as he used bimetallic strips a lot to allow for temperature shifts.

 

[JamezF]

I think that may have been the first 'ordinary' clock he built which was sited in a tower on top of a stable block, I'm sure his 'watches' were all (or mainly) metal as he used bimetallic strips a lot to allow for temperature shifts.

Ahh, perhaps so. I'm definitely thinking of a "clock" rather than a "watch". Still an amazing thing to achieve though. Makes my woodworking skills look distinctly third rate.

James