induced supersedure

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wightbees 

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I just read this in one of the books i have just received.
Brood Box with QE on
then a super
then another super but leave a small gap between the 2 supers so as to make a second entrance.
QC protected by silver foil around the cell placed in the top of the frames on the top super, The book calls these brood frames.( this would be easy for me as all my frames are the same size)
New Queen can go on mating flight using the second entrance, once laying you can go into the original brood box and remove the old Queen.

Has anyone done this ? Are there any benefits to using this method ?
I can think of one , that is the new queen is excepted and laying well before removing the old one.
Like i said just what i have read, what do you think ?

Just thought i would say that the tip of the QC is left exposed
 

Poly Hive 

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Quite a standard matter.

However... whilst you are correct that the queen is accepted, it has to be kept in mind that she has not been accepted by the bees with the old queen, ans so effectively you have two colonies in the one hive.

Nothing is straightforward.

PH
 

wightbees 

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Good point, so would it be better to the close the second entrance for a little while before taking the old queen out.Or is this pointless.
 

Hivemaker. 

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Better to stick another brood box on top of the supers on a board with an entrance in the rear...queen excluded hole in board,when queen in top brood box has mated you can remove the old queen in the bottom box, and move the top box down.
 

wightbees 

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I use all the same size boxes HM but apart from that is this system about right, i mean wrap the cell in foil to protect.Is there any need for this ?
 

Hivemaker. 

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I use all the same size boxes HM but apart from that is this system about right, i mean wrap the cell in foil to protect.Is there any need for this ?
No need to wrap the cell,but it can still be done as an extra precaution if wished,if it was being put into the bottom box then yes it would need to be protected.....still better to use a board with small entrance under your top box though.
 
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wightbees 

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Ok thanks for the info HM
 

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The book should say that bees will destroy a queen cell by ripping the sidewall while a queen will sting a queen through a sidewall also.

With a piece of foil the queen will hatch,she will then go looking for the old queen and kill her unless you have a QE between them.

If you are using a grafting system for queen cells then you can just pop a roller cage over the QC once its sealed,I do this and leave the bottom end of the cage open.
 

wightbees 

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I just read this in one of the books i have just received.
Brood Box with QE on
then a super
then another super but leave a small gap between the 2 supers so as to make a second entrance.
QC protected by silver foil around the cell placed in the top of the frames on the top super, The book calls these brood frames.( this would be easy for me as all my frames are the same size)
New Queen can go on mating flight using the second entrance, once laying you can go into the original brood box and remove the old Queen.

Has anyone done this ? Are there any benefits to using this method ?
I can think of one , that is the new queen is excepted and laying well before removing the old one.
Like i said just what i have read, what do you think ?

Just thought i would say that the tip of the QC is left exposed
This bit here Admin, is that what you mean ?
 

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Thats the bit..

Enjoy Manley,its a lovely book.
 

wightbees 

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Cheers , just need some piece and quiet lol
 

Walrus 

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Induced supersedure?

I had two spare sealed QCs that were about to emerge (not enough mating nucs & no incubator) so I tried something that I had talked about with Mike Palmer & Richard Noel:

removed the queen excluder and put QC in the top super between two honey frames.

Just checked on them today and both have definitely emerged rather than been torn down. I put them in 6 days ago so may not be mated yet. Not sure if the old queens are still there or not.
 
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Interesting Walrus....what's the thinking about what you are trying to achieve?
 

Walrus 

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Interesting Walrus....what's the thinking about what you are trying to achieve?
TBH I just wanted to see what would happen. For people who don't use queen excluders this is often where they make supersedure cells (up in the supers).
 

oliver90owner 

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Mind you, it is sooo simple to move that top box away, when the queen cell is sealed, and unite later IF the young queen is mated successfully and has reared at least one generation of brood. That way one can avoid losing the old queen until the traits of the new one are proven.

Replacing a good queen with a bad tempered,or patchy-laying, queen is not good progress.
 

Walrus 

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Mind you, it is sooo simple to move that top box away, when the queen cell is sealed, and unite later IF the young queen is mated successfully and has reared at least one generation of brood. That way one can avoid losing the old queen until the traits of the new one are proven.

Replacing a good queen with a bad tempered,or patchy-laying, queen is not good progress.
The introduced cell was 1 day off emerging, grafted from my best queen. You are right about the risks though. I was curious and had spare cells, plus I have plenty in mating nucs so if it doesn't work out I will be able to use a proven queen, assuming some of them turn out to be good.

Curiosity killed the walrus...
 

oliver90owner 

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I replied to the thread, not the hijack. Sorry, did not notice that the thread was years old. Why you didn’t start a fresh thread surprises me.
 

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