Import of NZ bees into UK

[oliver90owner]

Just seen this PM (@10:49 this morning) from Den:

Misinformation.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As I have said to others off forum, if you have a question ask me. I WILL answer it.

The imaginary figures being trotted out again and again do not shed light, only heat.

Just ask.

Murray

My response:

I did ask; you didn't answer. Side-stepped was my distinct impression. Much better to have things out in the open on the forum.

RAB

Unfortunately I should have changed the header to 'Information' of which there was precious little - until the rumours started (post #1 for me).

Obvious impression to me is he is trying to pick us off separately.

Anyone else been 'tickled' in a similar manner? From his PM it would, again, seem to me that there are others.

I, for one, am not interested in side-shows. The more 'heat' the better, maybe. The saying goes 'if you can't stand the heat, get out.........

Regards, RAB

 

[BKF Admin]

I am not a great lover of PM's being posted on an open forum.

The word "Private" gives a clue why I dont like it.

The pm above does not look as if it is saying anything that the sender would like kept private so I will leave it unless asked to remove it.

RAB,try not to post PM's,they are private for a reason.

Admin.

 

[victor meldrew]

Hear Hear admin.
The integrity of the PM system is at stake here !
The giving of an address/ telephone numbers etc are now compromised .
I will think twice before using this facility again , especially if no sanctions are brought to bear on any one breaking the sanctity of the PM !
PRIVATE, MEANS ,PRIVATE. Loathsome to some maybe .
Just remember, people on this forum have become friends and indeed have private things to discuss . The content of private messages are not all Chinese whispers!

John Wilkinson

 

[DanBee]

RAB - I don't see what you thought was sinister about that PM...

Also you seem to be the only one referring to ITLD/Murray as 'Den'. Have I missed something?

 

[Poly Hive]

Seems you would prefer to use Skype then John?



PH

 

[victor meldrew]

Seems you would prefer to use Skype then John?



PH

Meaning?

 

[victor meldrew]

I think perhaps you are referring to the skype icon on my avatar ?
Can't think what it's to do with the integrity of the PM facility on here?

JW

 

[Poly Hive]

Good grief John your worked up this afternoon,

Meaning I see you now have Skype on your little info tab thingy. First time I have seen it is all.

*ducks for cover c/w tin helmet firmly on*

PH

 

[victor meldrew]

Missed my response by a millisecond

JW

 

[Into the lions den]

Just seen this PM (@10:49 this morning) from Den:
Obvious impression to me is he is trying to pick us off separately.

I see little point in thrashing away over the same ground again and again in open forum. I have approached a *few* off forum to try to engage them in dialogue.

Responses have varied, from friendly and understanding, to being outright blanked. Only you have seen fit to actually trample on my attempt by publishing it, and attributing such a motive to me.

to admin: Please leave his posting on the site. I have said nothing I am ashamed of off forum to anyone.

 

[oliver90owner]

Sorry admin,

I will desist in future. You know that I would not normally do this. It looked to me like a standard issue PM likely sent, separately, to more than one recipient. An inexpensive attempt to stifle on-forum discussion. However I will reveal the gist of contents of such unsolicited approaches where I consider the approach has undertones of keeping material from the forum. I would be very interested to hear from others who have had 'off forum' approaches such as this.

I asked a few questions early on. Here is the exchange:

Two out of 200 threw castes in 2010.

Exactly what do you mean by that? To me that means multiple swarming! So how many threw a prime swarm? How long were these bees in the UK? In a scottish environment, those statistics can be misleading in isolation

10 day inspection cycle.

The queens will all be clipped, I presume?
................

So this will be 600 packages of bees imported over two seasons or three?


There was no recorded response to these questions, so I asked again

Two out of 200 threw castes in 2010.

Exactly what do you mean by that? To me that means multiple swarming! So how many threw a prime swarm? How long were these bees in the UK? In a scottish environment, those statistics can be misleading in isolation

Nicely avoided that question first time round. So let me ask again. What exactly did you mean? Were you trying to lay a red herring? Mention of casts instead of 'swarms' immediately rings alarm bells for me, especially when the poster then ignores the request for clarification.

The following appeared but there were simply no answers to my questions. Totally side-stepped!

I sent a long and full explanation of this but I cannot see it having appeared. Is there a limit on post length? Seems maybe only half of an effort at addressing your points appeared. Not going hunting it all again at quarter to one in the morning.

Suffice to say we know exactly what happened with these two colonies. Knocked right over and no livestock on the farm and no vehicle track nearby. Probable vandalism attack causing queen death and thus emergency cells, whilst colonies were still small. Two small swarms the size of pint pots on bushes adjacent to the site.....and from the rest of the colony being as it was we KNOW only one cast or caste had come out.

So you see, no answers to any of my questions at all.

I would not expect there to have been any prime swarms lost if the queens are clipped, but I might if a ten day inspection cycle was adhered to and they were not! A follow up might have been 'How many queens attempted to swarm?'

And now danbee thinks the PM was innocuous. He is naive, me thinks - or trying to minimise the intended ramping up of the heat.

RAB

 

[greatbritishhoney]

There has been a lot of talk about "facts" recently in this thread and some recriminations about people getting the wrong end of the stick.
Whilst all this is probably true, it has to said that the "facts" have dribbled out slowly and this has increased the suspicions about the project - making it potentially look rather shady. Had there been a full and frank consultation with local beekeepers in the affected area then perhaps some of the "misinformation" may not have become entrenched. I'm quite surprised that the Co-op didn't think to do some kind of consultation with local beekeepers before embarking on this project.
One has to ask - if the project is so safe, wonderful etc why has it not been shouted from the rooftops before Somerford raised the initial concerns on here?

 

[greatbritishhoney]

And, more to the point, why is it not being touted on the Plan Bee website? If they can't make a good PR story out of it then it suggests that they'd rather it stayed quiet. One has to ask why?

 

[Somerford]

I see little point in thrashing away over the same ground again and again in open forum. I have approached a *few* off forum to try to engage them in dialogue.

Responses have varied, from friendly and understanding, to being outright blanked. Only you have seen fit to actually trample on my attempt by publishing it, and attributing such a motive to me.

to admin: Please leave his posting on the site. I have said nothing I am ashamed of off forum to anyone.

Interesting that as the creator of the thread my PM box is empty from ITLD...I'd be happy to attend a meeting with the co-op with Ron Hoskins et al....but clearly I am seen to be totally entrenched and too much to be communicated with (my words, spoken with tongue firmly in cheek) but my opinions have barely altered since post #1

S

 

[Crg]

And now danbee thinks the PM was innocuous. He is naive, me thinks - or trying to minimise the intended ramping up of the heat.

RAB

You're naive if you thinking posting private messages will help.

Very poor form. You've continued even after the issue has brought to your attention.

 

[oliver90owner]

There you go again. Shame it will be noted by anyone else who might get one!

 

[Into the lions den]

And, more to the point, why is it not being touted on the Plan Bee website? If they can't make a good PR story out of it then it suggests that they'd rather it stayed quiet. One has to ask why?

It will be, the specific section of the website is still under construction. The latest design meeting took place last Tuesday. Only today I was in consultation with a video technology company appointed some time ago by the Co-op regarding the installation of hive entrance webcams and overall apiary ones so the viewer can see the work being done during hive visits. Just not ready yet, as there are serious technical difficulties regarding bandwidth for mobile installations at remote distances from buildings.

As regards the consultation part. I do not actually know why they did not, but I did discuss them the disparate and vociferous opinions that would inevitably arise. Nothing thrown up so far was left unconsidered other than the fact neither the Co-op nor myself were aware of Ron Hoskins.

That has been rectified and they were made aware of him initially by myself, followed up a day or two later by a couple of messages (do not know if they were letters or e-mails).

The bottom line is that this is their land and their crops. Their call who uses the land, and in this case it is themselves. Co-operative Farms are an ethical modern farming company and the bees are with them. Plan Bee is operated by a different section of the overall organisation.

They had, and still do not have, any obligation to publicise the project at all, as it is all completely legal. that it is being discussed from this end at all is surely a sign of our wish to allay fears and deal with unfounded rumours.

 

[oliver90owner]

completely legal.

As I have said previously, I am sure it is. I think it is the ethics of the whole project that have an unwanted aroma of under the table, no consultation, do it anyway, business.

 

[greatbritishhoney]

The bottom line is that this is their land and their crops.

I wondered when we'd get to that stage.

 

[Hivemaker.]

The coop are doing there best,just read this on there web site.

No-one knows for certain what is causing bee losses. Explanations include: bad weather, pesticides, importing of non-native bee species, viruses and a mite called Varroa.