Honey £16 per lb

[greatbritishhoney]

In my opinion anyone who is earning more than their yearly tax allowance (£7500 or whatever it is) should at least consider the possibility that they may be liable for tax on their extra income.
(Remember that the tax allowance includes your day job if you have one).

If in doubt - ring your local tax office.

 

[MandF]

Disagreed and so will trading standards, if you sell to a shop off site you are trading to gain profit and will be of interest to HMRC and trading standards and the local food regs ppl.

You cant ignore but the degree of interest may vary, volumes, thresholds etc

Why beekeepers seem to think the law is special for them I dont get it.

Since when did a hobby stop it being trading, sole trader status is required if you trade.

Dont like it? then dont go placing you product on the same shelf as Rowse or Gales or any other producer.

IMHO

Well you said it yourself, sort of, "trading to gain profit".. but you meant "selling to gain profit" I think?

If you are selling something (doesnt matter if its in a shop or at a car boot sale), to gain a profit, then you are likely to be deemed as "trading".

If you are selling honey, I would argue, if you are a hobbyist beekeeper you are simply recovering/covering costs.. ie noone of sane mind becomes a hobbyist beekeeper to make money. if you want to make money selling honey it is a damn sight easier to just buy in bulk, buy some bottles and labels, and sell jars of honey. That most definitely WOULD be seen as trading.

Just because you sell stuff, even via someone elses shop, it does NOT by default mean you are "trading"... if it did then HMRC wouldnt have a list of tests to determine if someone was indeed trading and therefore liable for tax.

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/bimmanual/BIM20205.htm

 

[dpearce4]

Maybe we should stop this thread before Admin gets contacted by HMRC and asks for email addresses for all to contact re Tax

lol lol

 

[drstitson]

In Italy small producers are allowed to earn a small amount tax free (around 2500 euro in think) and even more (7500 euro) if based in a small village (<1000 popn). Also exempt from giving receipts without fear of a visit from the "yellow flames" (finance police).

 

[rae]

The inland revenue don't care whether you get money from a hobby, work, self employment, whatever. Money is money to them. I am not aware of any exemptions for "hobbies".

So, you should declare your beekeeping earnings, and you should declare your profit - they will tax you on the profit. Now my profits are as near as dammit zero (catastrophically loss making for the last two years). I can see that if I get good at it and turn a decent profit, I will set up as a small business and get VAT registered.

At the moment I am confident that my hobby could stand up to any inspection by HMRC as the revenue is considerably less than the Thornes bill....

 

[NoBBy]

This is Sconner Wood

http://www.bdcc.co.uk/XMarksTheSpot.htm?g=SX3552656715&t=SX3552656715


.

 

[Winker]

So the long and the short of it is, that person selling their honey on Ebay has just been saved a visit from the TAX man and a visit from Trading standards.

See that, all is well, that ends well

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Erm, for one you dont have to pay tax on any hobby, even if you make a small profit. Second, if you make a profit selling honey I want to know your secret!!

As for the label, if this person is unaware of the rules/regulation with regards to labelling, who knows what else they are unaware of. I'm sure food poisoning or thymol flavoured honey or honey with bee bits etc., will do a lot for the prices the public will pay for OUR honey. Also, flouting the law is not going to make the laws more lax, it is going to make them more onerous for the rest of us.

It really isnt too much to ask is it?

I think this thread has lost its way somewhat, the point is that the person's advertising on ebay were a bit erroneous - so together with incorrect labelling etc - is/was it actually British honey (or honey at all) and yes is it safe to eat eh?

 

[MuswellMetro]

Maybe we should stop this thread before Admin gets contacted by HMRC and asks for email addresses for all to contact re Tax

lol lol

from the HRMC web site, hobby income is not taxable

"Hobby: Income from a hobby is not taxable and related expenses are not allowable.
There are criteria to differentiate between a business and a hobby. If in doubt, contact the Inland Revenue, accountant or Tax Advisor."


Muswell Metro
Ex HM Examiner of Surtax ( grade B)
Special commissioner of the Inland revenue
1967 to 1969

i did not last long as they abolished Surtax

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

from the HRMC web site, hobby income is not taxable

"Hobby: Income from a hobby is not taxable and related expenses are not allowable.
There are criteria to differentiate between a business and a hobby. If in doubt, contact the Inland Revenue, accountant or Tax Advisor."


Muswell Metro
Ex HM Examiner of Surtax ( grade B)
Special commissioner of the Inland revenue
1967 to 1969

i did not last long as they abolished Surtax

Got out before they de-humanised you then!
Lucky I didn't rant on a bit about my ex (as we are again not part of the revenue!) so called colleagues, thanks for putting that bit on from the HMRC website, was going to dig it out myself tomorrow!
BTW when you joined the department I was being born!!

 

[pandtpoultry]

Confused - some people are complaining that someone sells honey at £16 a lb so jump on labelling etc but overall it seems most people lose money hand over fist in this hobby? On this basis should not the price be reviewed? Come on people if you have a quality product why under price it? Wether £16 a lb is achievable I doubt currently but over a few years ....... also on ebay there are huge listing, selling and paypal fees which i would not be shocked work out at over £5 per lb dont forget postage. Dont report them advise them of labelling issues would be better. If I ever get into a position to sell my honey then I can assure you it will not be for a few pence I will be one whom trys to sell at a price that allows re-investment into my beekeeping.
I say well done to them if genuine and should be encouraged and helped if they made a mistake in anything as it will help all in the long run.
Whom even breaks even on their current honey sales allowing for equipment purchases, time, medication etc...? Lets review whom we shoot down when we are all breaking even at the very least.

 

[MandF]

I would assume their listing got zapped because of the illegal labelling and nothing else.

They will still get the message, hopefully check the regulations and do new labels, and re-list them.

I dont think anyone was complaining about the price they were attempting to sell at?

As I said before, if you are going to sell your honey to the public so visibly (and have "world famous" honey), is it too much to ask that you comply with the law in terms of labelling?!

 

[greatbritishhoney]

I didn't actually get to see the original listing because it had been removed before I saw this thread.
Is it a certainty that the labelling was illegal? At the start of the thread it seemed that a few people thought it might be but couldn't tell properly due to the size of the photo.
These doubts now seem to have turned into certainty.

 

[pandtpoultry]

I think it is important to get the labelling correct but lets give a little grace here I live in a world where laws are too confusing for all. Sometimes judgements here are harsh, lets just chill a little explain their error and give them time to correct it - aids us all in the long run

 

[chalkie]

I didn't actually get to see the original listing because it had been removed before I saw this thread.
Is it a certainty that the labelling was illegal? At the start of the thread it seemed that a few people thought it might be but couldn't tell properly due to the size of the photo.
These doubts now seem to have turned into certainty.

Original listing is still viewable through the link provided in the first posting in this thread.

 

[greatbritishhoney]

Original listing is still viewable through the link provided in the first posting in this thread.

You are totally right chalkie!
I was just too dim to scroll down

 

[For want of a better word]

Looked at a few labels on honey jars at a local ( to Sconner wood Polbathic) farm shop.
Selling at £6.50 for 12 oz!...most had incorrect batch numbers, no best before date... only imperial weights and pictures of flowers I have never seen in this part of Cornwall!!
Maybe the labels were old stock being used up as the poor producer could not afford new ones, and could see no reason to waste them?
Then copper wire was invented by two Cornishmen fighting over a Farthing... or so them over the Tamar say !!!

 

[greatbritishhoney]

Having now looked at the link, I think you may have a point about incorrect labelling. However, we should probably bear in mind that stuff like best before, batch number etc could be on a separate label on the back of the jar or the bottom. I know quite a few beeks who do that.

 

[For want of a better word]

Having now looked at the link, I think you may have a point about incorrect labelling. However, we should probably bear in mind that stuff like best before, batch number etc could be on a separate label on the back of the jar or the bottom. I know quite a few beeks who do that.

or maybee even tramp it on the lid with indelible ink?

 

[Hebeegeebee]

it must be last years honey.

Read post #13?

The ad said Autumn honey. That's last year.