Hoffmans and dummy boards

[nessieb]

Hi all,
I'm posting yet another question about hoffman frames as I cant find the answer I'm looking for on here elsewhere.
Anyway...
I have bought some Hoffman converter clips from Th**nes for use in the brood box in my National Hives. I also bought some Dummy boards from Th**nes with the idea that I would use 11 Hoffmans and a dummy board.
However...
The dummy board is narrower than I expected (about 1cm wide) and there is ALOT of room left with 11 frames and the dummy board. If I push the dummy board up against the frames there is a gap of 3cm between the dummy and the hive wall! If I try 12 Hoffman frames without the dummy there is still a little movement but would this still be the case when they are all propolised up?
Also the space between the wall of the hive and the first frames seems narrow - about 7mm from the wall to top bar.
Can anyone shed any light on this for me?
Thanks

 

[oliver90owner]

Hive dimensions are the key and give the clues.

420mm for twelve frames at a squeeze is 35mm per frame. Remove one and replace it with a 10mm Should give a clue as to why there is a large space. It should be about 25mm, unless your frames are slightly undersized.

Not sure what more light you want shedding. Just a bit of simple maths.

RAB

 

[SimonB]

The dummy board is narrower than I expected (about 1cm wide) and there is ALOT of room left with 11 frames and the dummy board.

If you are worried about the bees building wild comb in the gap then I wouldn't be. Mine don't, the reason being, I believe, is that there is no adjacent comb to encourage them to build parallel to.

Also, I wouldn't butt the dummy board right up against the last frame if you want the bees to use that side of the frame, there is insufficient bee space. Instead place it such that bee space is consistent with the space between the other frames, ie away from the last fram by a few mm or so.

 

[nessieb]

I just assumed that the frames would fit more snuggly they dont seem as secure as castellated.
So, should I use 12 frames or 11 and the dummy leaving the large gap? Will the 12 become tight? Also do you push the end hoffman frame up against the hive wall?

 

[Busybee123]

I just assumed that the frames would fit more snuggly they dont seem as secure as castellated.
So, should I use 12 frames or 11 and the dummy leaving the large gap? Will the 12 become tight? Also do you push the end hoffman frame up against the hive wall?

If you use 11 frames and a dummy, when you open the hive you can slide the dummy back (or remove it) and you then have plenty of room to manipulate the frames without "rolling" the bees. If you use 12 frames then removing the first frame can be a bit tricky.

Having said all that my brood chamber comfortably holds 12 frames (with about 4 or 5 mm to spare) so I have put 12 Hoffman frames in the box - seems a shame not to use all the available space.

 

[johnandyrob]

I have always used 11 frames and a dummy board ( board in the middle of the remaining space). I acquired a hive with 12 frames in and it wasn't getting the twelfth frame out that was the biggest problem it was getting it back in.

 

[drstitson]

the space "behind" the dummy board doesn't matter - the point of the board is to give the bees a new limit to their comb building.

think about when first putting a nuc in a brood box - you have 4-6 established frames, a 1-2 with foundation and a dummy board - leaving a large gap which the bees don't use.