From poly to wood hive?

[Moobee]

With colonies that are already agressive and pinging at that distance even if he has QC's that will produce queens that are going to be open mated there are still the genetics there and there's every likelihood that the agressive traits will be maintained. No responsible beekeeper should ever be selling agressive colonies ... certainly not at full price. Sounds like he's on the less respectable fringe of beekeeping. Did he give you a reason he was selling them ? From the sounds of it they have not been well inspected in recent weeks which does not bode well ....

The aggressive hive only had capped brood, no eggs or young brood and I checked the frames twice to be certain. No QCs. They must have been queenless for a while, I wouldn’t be surprised if he had inadvertently dispatched the queen watching how he handled them, would that have made them more feisty? He is selling as the owner of the land where the out apiary is, has to move out soon. He is a member of our local BKA so I have advised the chairman of the reason we are not buying his bees as they were advertised in the monthly newsletter.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

No faff
Boxes don’t need cleaning. They need sterilising if there has been disease
The bees put a lot of energy into lining their home with propolis.
Just scrape odd bit that gets in the way gently with a hive tool

Boils down to the usual suspects who have always had an obsession with 'spring cleaning' even Manley saw fit to mention it way back in 1947.
Funnily enough we saw a bit of it on the boats as well - people who didn't quite know what they were doing (or what they should be doing), when in doubt would just grab a cloth and a bucket and do a bit of washing down

 

[pargyle]

The aggressive hive only had capped brood, no eggs or young brood and I checked the frames twice to be certain. No QCs. They must have been queenless for a while, I wouldn’t be surprised if he had inadvertently dispatched the queen watching how he handled them, would that have made them more feisty? He is selling as the owner of the land where the out apiary is, has to move out soon. He is a member of our local BKA so I have advised the chairman of the reason we are not buying his bees as they were advertised in the monthly newsletter.

A queen less hive can demonstrate aggression...so if one was queen less that could be the reason... either way... if he knew they were feisty he should not really be selling them without telling people the full story. Just not acceptable... If he had passed them on to a new beekeeper without them knowing they could have really been in trouble ... we've seen it before on here ... new beekeeper - vile bees ... not a happy ending in most cases. I've had to deal with one that a newbie had bought off the internet.... it was one if those experiences I'd rather not repeat and it was so traumatic for the newbie that she gave up... I had helped her re queen the colony and it had calmed them down but the first impression of bees that were trying to kill her dented her confidence so much it never recovered. People selling bees should either sell good stock or tell the truth and accept that there is a cost implication.

 

[Earthboy]

I've got a single poly that I carry in the back of my pickup all the time; it is about 30 years old; I repainted and duct-taped many times to maintain its structural integrity. I love its light weight. Yesterday, for instance, I was able to hoist it up right under a swarm with my left arm while yanking the branch with my right hand. It is my go-to retrieval box for swarms and cutouts. I love recycling anything I can reuse or repurpose. In fact my Japanese mule (Toyota pickup) is a 1991 model, older than most of my students.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Boils down to the usual suspects who have always had an obsession with 'spring cleaning' even Manley saw fit to mention it way back in 1947.
Funnily enough we saw a bit of it on the boats as well - people who didn't quite know what they were doing (or what they should be doing), when in doubt would just grab a cloth and a bucket and do a bit of washing down

Classic demonstration of the motto "bullsh*t baffles brains". Very few inspections concentrated on freshly cleaned or painted equipment

 

[Martimart]

I’m also unhappy about environmental footprint of using poly.

My poly hives will last over 30 years - easily, IMO. They will be fully recyclable at the end of life.

I still use some timber floors and supers - and at times timber roofs (with polystyrene insulation, of course).

Your choice but the environmental footprint is just an easy cop-out for people who don’t check out the advantages and the real costs over the hive lifetime. Most of my hives were all timber - because I could make them, but not bought any more timber since trying poly.

Can you provide a link or details on how the plastic in poly is recycled, your Poly hives will actually last well over 200 years in landfill

 

[bingevader]

Can you provide a link or details on how the plastic in poly is recycled, your Poly hives will actually last well over 200 years in landfill

I was waiting for that too, rather than it being all my fault that the polystyrene I have is rubbish.
The wood I have, however, is excellent!

Another question though! Polystyrene is made from?

 

[BugsInABox]

I was waiting for that too, rather than it being all my fault that the polystyrene I have is rubbish.
The wood I have, however, is excellent!

Another question though! Polystyrene is made from?

oil?

 

[Earthboy]

This is a new version of what I bought a long time ago and it is not from recycled material:



I am aware, though, they are recycling poly in the mattress industry:

https://polyurethane.americanchemistry.com/Polyurethane-Recycling/
I wish someone to come up with plastic recycled hive bodies. That will be win/win.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Can you provide a link or details on how the plastic in poly is recycled, your Poly hives will actually last well over 200 years in landfill

https://www.molygran.com/polystyrene-recycling/

 

[North End Bees]

https://www.molygran.com/polystyrene-recycling/

That's alright but they only take clean white polystyrene. Presumably the sort of stuff that's just been unwrapped from your new washing machine?

Not painted, propolised, gunky boxes. I can't imagine beekeepers scraping down their hives to clean white material and then driving halfway across the country to deliver them to the recycler. In reality, they'll just get chucked in landfill.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

That's alright but they only take clean white polystyrene. Presumably the sort of stuff that's just been unwrapped from your new washing machine?

Not painted, propolised, gunky boxes. I can't imagine beekeepers scraping down their hives to clean white material and then driving halfway across the country to deliver them to the recycler. In reality, they'll just get chucked in landfill.

I can't see my poly nucs needing replacing for quite a few years, got some here ten years old and just a lick of paint would make them look as new again. I think that some people are just so mired in the disposable culture that they feel compelled to change things for new every few years.
It is not the fact that these hives need to be replaced, rather the beekeeper seems to need to replace them. If they don't need replacing, there is no need to recycle.
I've seen wooden hive parts on sale at auctions that were made pre 1939 - I can see there being no difference in future when it comes to poly hives.
I think what we are seeing is a display of self righteousness rather than practicality.

 

[Boston Bees]

That's alright but they only take clean white polystyrene. Presumably the sort of stuff that's just been unwrapped from your new washing machine?

Not painted, propolised, gunky boxes. I can't imagine beekeepers scraping down their hives to clean white material and then driving halfway across the country to deliver them to the recycler. In reality, they'll just get chucked in landfill.

Correct. Best not to have a rose-tinted view of this. I use 100% poly boxes and I hope they will last me a long time. But I know that when they are finished, they will end up in landfill or an incinerator. Given that they are products that can last many many years before this happens, I can live with this (I have been beekeeping for 7 years and have yet to come close to throwing away a poly product).

 

[North End Bees]

Given that they are products that can last many many years before this happens, I can live with this (I have been beekeeping for 7 years and have yet to come close to throwing away a poly product).

Yes, hopefully they'll last years with a bit of care. I only use poly for nucs but I did manage to snap the roof off one in half last year.

Also got quite a few roofs pecked at by birds. Any overwintering nucs now get a square of DPM strapped over the top which seems to deter them!

 

[Boston Bees]

I only use poly for nucs but I did manage to snap the roof off one in half last year.

Paynes?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Paynes?

hardly hurt at all

 

[North End Bees]

Paynes?

No, old style maisie's.

hardly hurt at all

Not physically but it didn't do my temper much good!

 

[ericbeaumont]

wood supers can fit on poly hives, but there is a lip as the poly is thicker.

No lip on the standard 11 frame 460x460mm Abelo box, which is entirely compatible with wood National.

All other makes have issues of compatibility.

Yes, water sometimes creeps in, but it'll also do so with wood.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Yeah, but not by beekeepers in the 7960 years before that.

More's the pity!

 

[drdrday]

I have poly nucs (mainly because they're nice and light), but despite being aware of the better insulation offered by poly hives I deliberately went for cedar for my main hives (albeit with lots of Kingspan insulation in the roof, and Kingspan follower boards in the double broods over winter). My decision wasn't based on environmental reasons, but concerns about longevity, squashing bees, and aesthetics in the garden.
Personally, and I'm sure it's just me, I find it almost impossible to inspect poly boxes without squashing bees in the locking rims. I prefer flat surfaces that I can twist and slide into position and avoid bees. I also find it far too easy to take gouges out of the poly boxes.
Of course, if I ever have more than a handful of hives I'm sure poly would probably become my preference.