First sting of the year

[pargyle]

I am not asking you to and as well as my own safety I don't approve of gassing the bees with oxalic and formic at regular 5 day intervals for up to 12 times or in the honey season as oxalic acid dissolves in honey and can lead to kidney failure if ingested in quantities.

Fake News Beeno ...

a) You are not 'Gassing' anything - the OA sublimates as an ultra fine powder which only kills the varroa.
b) Formic acid does not form with any proprietary sublimator
c) You would not do it when there are supers on the hives
d) Nobody would normally treat them 12 times - three times at 5 day intervals will get 90% of the mites through the brood cycles
e) How would the OA get dissolved in honey when done by sublimation any more than it would with your chosen method of trickling
f) I see little or no concern from the bees when they are treated with OA by sublimation and yet your bees - opened up, frames taken out and then drenched in OA dissolved in sugar syrup ends up with you getting stung and the bees clearly hating what you did to them.
g) Personal safety is easily taken care of with a full face mask with appropriate filters - the chances of ingesting it are remote if you follow the guidance.

I don't mind if you don't like and don't want to use OA by sublimation - feel free to keep going with your antiquated and disruptive method ... but let's stick to the facts and not spread rubbish about.

 

[Erichalfbee]

It is so important to make sure that the veil is kept clear of a beekeeper's face. In my experience there have been occasions when bees have been feisty, even though they have been placid on other occasions.
Perhaps this discussion thread should include comments about experiences and/or recommendations about different styles of beekeeping veils.
The bee-suit which I bought has a round hat with gauze/net which extends downwards from the rim of the hat, and connects with a wire loop of the same diameter at shoulder level. When I first started to use this suit, I found that it was possible for the veil to touch the skin of my face in some situations - and the bees discovered this too!
There were also a couple of occasions when bees managed to get inside the veil as well. On one occasion I actually had two bees walking on the inside of my veil, but thankfully I was not stung, and was able to get away from the hives to be able to get the bees safely removed.
The reason why I am telling this story is that after these experiences I did some thinking about how to prevent these kinds of problems.
I made an additional wire hoop from thin spring-steel wire, and stitched it to the inside of the veil, about half-way between the hat-rim level and shoulder-level (around about the level of the tip of my nose). This has been entirely successful in keeping the veil well away from the skin of my face - in fact it is now difficult to even deliberately press the veil against my face.
The other problem, of bees being able to find a way to get inside of the veil, has also been solved (at least it has up till now!). There is a flap which covers the spot where the zips meet up (near the throat, under the chin). This flap is held down by velcro fastening strips, but I found that these strips were only on the sides of the flap on my bee suit. There was no similar velcro along the bottom of the flap, and it was possible for bees to crawl through this small space. I have sewn in additional velcro to completely close the bottom of the flap against the suit, and have not had any further problem.
On a recent occasion, when I had hundreds of bees flying around my head, it was rather comforting to have the confidence that bees could not get to my face.

A simple solution that is used by many is to wear a cap under a fencing veil. A round hat shouldn't need anything.
I have had bees get in where the zips meet at the back; angry bees! very angry bees

 

[understanding_bees]

A round hat shouldn't need anything.

I agree that a round hat should not NEED anything. The facts remain, in my case the veil did touch my face, and also the back of my head, at least some of the time, depending on the particular movements I made. The stings I received through the veil were painful, and stings on the face are not pleasant.
I offered the suggestion of an additional wire loop, because in my case this has been a completely successful solution to that particular problem. I know that this solution may not be applicable for all styles of veil, but hope that it will help beekeepers who have suits similar to mine.

 

[drex]

I will not vape as I value my own health too much for that and if you don't look and to ensure they are broodless both methods are useless. As I have said above I had reason to be concerned.

In addition to Pargyles comments above. OA vaping is never useless. Its efficacy is reduced when brood is present. I intend to vape on the first warmer day after this cold snap. I will not bother to check for presence of brood, as the statistics are on my side.

 

[Brendan14]

I got stung on my finger this year purely by accident trying to get one of my bees out of my car. Long story short it ended up between my fingers and stung me.
My finger had a bad reaction and I had to call the doctor and send him some images.
He gave me some antibiotics but also gave me some really strong antihistamines which you can only get on prescription and these worked instantly.
I will try to dig them out and post on here.

 

[The Poot]

A simple solution that is used by many is to wear a cap under a fencing veil. A round hat shouldn't need anything.
I have had bees get in where the zips meet at the back; angry bees! very angry bees

View attachment 23307

One of these would do it. Ordered one earlier in the week

 

[beeno]

I agree that a round hat should not NEED anything. The facts remain, in my case the veil did touch my face, and also the back of my head, at least some of the time, depending on the particular movements I made. The stings I received through the veil were painful, and stings on the face are not pleasant.
I offered the suggestion of an additional wire loop, because in my case this has been a completely successful solution to that particular problem. I know that this solution may not be applicable for all styles of veil, but hope that it will help beekeepers who have suits similar to mine.

I have been stung on the chin twice. Once with round hat looking up collecting a swarm and this time fencing hat looking down - on both occasions whilst wearing a baseball cap. Heat of the moment not concentrating on veiI position. Do need a new hat which type of hat are you talking about pls.

 

[beeno]

In addition to Pargyles comments above. OA vaping is never useless. Its efficacy is reduced when brood is present. I intend to vape on the first warmer day after this cold snap. I will not bother to check for presence of brood, as the statistics are on my side.

And which stats would that be? Same old same old or something different?

 

[beeno]

I got stung on my finger this year purely by accident trying to get one of my bees out of my car. Long story short it ended up between my fingers and stung me.
My finger had a bad reaction and I had to call the doctor and send him some images.
He gave me some antibiotics but also gave me some really strong antihistamines which you can only get on prescription and these worked instantly.
I will try to dig them out and post on here.

The wasp sting that gave me a systemic reaction was on my thumb, so hands can be problematic too.

 

[GowerSteve]

I copied this from the BMJ site "ABC of allergies": "Bee and wasp venoms are different, each containing distinct major allergens, which are well defined. Phospholipase A2 and mellitin occur only in bee venom, and antigen 5 only in wasp venom, but both venoms contain hyaluronidases. Patients allergic to wasp venom are rarely allergic to bee venom." I can't see why these toxins would be particularly susceptible to pH

 

[GowerSteve]

Sorry, missed out the citation: BMJ. 1998 May 2; 316(7141): 1365–1368.

 

[user 819]

In addition to Pargyles comments above. OA vaping is never useless. Its efficacy is reduced when brood is present. I intend to vape on the first warmer day after this cold snap. I will not bother to check for presence of brood, as the statistics are on my side.

Same here drex, weather forecasted (S/E area) from 16th - 20th appears to be a 3 or 4c higher after next couple of weeks before getting a bit colder again. Though one can't trust the forecast just a case of keeping an eye on the ball.

Our assoc has one member who plans on doing a ratniek's, she is planning on disrupting the colony to uncap any brood before vaping, really !!!
Let's hope she doesn't have an issue as Beeno has.

 

[Swarm]

May be just as well to point out to any novice beekeepers reading this that it is not the norm to be opening hives and lifting frames Nov/Dec.

 

[madasafish]

Same here drex, weather forecasted (S/E area) from 16th - 20th appears to be a 3 or 4c higher after next couple of weeks before getting a bit colder again. Though won can't trust the forecast just a case of keeping an eye on the ball.

Ditto: my third week of December..

 

[Erichalfbee]

And which stats would that be? Same old same old or something different?

Randy Oliver has a reference
Number 4 in his list
http://scientificbeekeeping.com/oxalic-acid-questions-answers-and-more-questions-part-1-of-2-parts/

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

And which stats would that be? Same old same old or something different?

I suggest that maybe you read up a bit on the system instead of pointificating from a position of ignorance.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I copied this from the BMJ site "ABC of allergies": "Bee and wasp venoms are different, each containing distinct major allergens, which are well defined. Phospholipase A2 and mellitin occur only in bee venom, and antigen 5 only in wasp venom, but both venoms contain hyaluronidases. Patients allergic to wasp venom are rarely allergic to bee venom." I can't see why these toxins would be particularly susceptible to pH

Well SWMBO gets severe reactions to both, although the wasp stings are not quite as impressive. (she wouldn't let me take any photos is either case

 

[Amari]

I got stung on my finger this year purely by accident trying to get one of my bees out of my car. Long story short it ended up between my fingers and stung me.
My finger had a bad reaction and I had to call the doctor and send him some images.
He gave me some antibiotics but also gave me some really strong antihistamines which you can only get on prescription and these worked instantly.
I will try to dig them out and post on here.

A local beek was also given antibiotics after a nasty sting earlier this year. At grave risk** of exceeding my brief (long retired medic) I cannot see the logic of prescribing an antibiotic. We're meant to be restricting their use for proven purposes. Ignorance/covering his back I suggest. What do you think Drex?
** Thankfully I'm no longer on the Medical Register so cannot be struck off!

 

[Apple]

A local beek was also given antibiotics after a nasty sting earlier this year. At grave risk** of exceeding my brief (long retired doctor) I cannot see the logic of prescribing an antibiotic. We're meant to be restricting their use for proven purposes. Ignorance/covering his back I suggest. What do you think Drex?
** Thankfully I'm no longer on the Medical Register so cannot be expelled

Perhaps the sting site became infected?
Sadly had a friend almost die after a mere nettle rash to her legs became infected... sepsis!

 

[Amari]

Perhaps the sting site became infected?
Sadly had a friend almost die after a mere nettle rash to her legs became infected... sepsis!

Theoretically after a couple of days I suppose but in my friend's case and probably Brendan's the antibiotic was given acutely = shortly after the sting ie. before 'sepsis' or 'became infected' would occur. I've never heard of a bee sting becoming infected. .