Drawing out Comb

[BeeJayBee]

BTW who sold you a nuc that small?

a 'manufactured nuc started with one frame of brood then a queen introduced IMHO

Some poor "nucs" being sold this year by some dealers.

 

[Ben Smith]

Don't feed them if they have stores. They will fill valuable laying space. They should be bringing some in themselves. Keep an eye on stores.

But isn't the whole idea of feeding them to encourage them to draw out the foundation?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yes, if there's nothing else but at times of plenty they will forage and feed and fill the foundation as soon as it's drawn with nectar/syrup instead of brood.

 

[badger65]

It might encourage them or not to draw comb. They may fill it with the sugar provided, they may not. You don't want to be in a position where the queen wants to lay more eggs as the population rises but can't because the frames are full of sugar. They will draw comb as they need it and it is better if they are filled with nectar. I have fed a nuc I currently have but they aren't taking it or drawing comb. The queen is not laying yet and they are bringing in their own forage.

 

[REDWOOD]

Just a thought but did your nuc come in a travelling box with lots of ventilation, if so don't put it back in dummy down the hive they are in.

 

[Ben Smith]

Yes, if there's nothing else but at times of plenty they will forage and feed and fill the foundation as soon as it's drawn with nectar/syrup instead of brood.

Ahh. So its a bit of a balancing act. A matter of checking if they have sufficient stores and plenty of available forage I assume. So best only to feed when stores are low or bad weather persists?

 

[Ben Smith]

Just a thought but did your nuc come in a travelling box with lots of ventilation, if so don't put it back in dummy down the hive they are in.

Assuming the 5 frame nuc becomes full and ready to transfer, how many frames of foundation would you add when transferring?

 

[badger65]

Personally I would add the lot once you move them.

 

[Finman]

.
If you buy a 5 frame nuc, the should not be any foundations. There should be at least 3 full frame of brood, one frame food and pollen and one empty comb.

 

[oliver90owner]

Just two.

 

[Finman]

Personally I would add the lot once you move them.

When I have moved nucs 50 years, I have never put foundations for transferring. What is that idea?
After transferring I leave the nuc and it is in final setup.

 

[badger65]

Just saying that when the nuts 5 frames are full, transfer expand hive to full frames

 

[REDWOOD]

Assuming the 5 frame nuc becomes full and ready to transfer, how many frames of foundation would you add when transferring?

Two in May, this time of year (hot weather no rain) Three or four, also depends on what frame size you have, 14x12 two frames max.

 

[Ben Smith]

Two in May, this time of year (hot weather no rain) Three or four, also depends on what frame size you have, 14x12 two frames max.

See now when I transferred six full 14 x 12 frames to a brood box I added five frames of foundation. Then I realised that I should have put a dummy in so quickly made one and replaced one frame of foundation for the dummy.
What are the disadvantages/drawbacks of adding four frames of foundation over just two?

 

[Finman]

.
When you add 100% hive room, it takes lots of time that bees can use it. And the build up will be slower in half occupied hive. Brood volume may be -50% than in tight hive room.
But if you have bigger hives and you give one full frame of emerging brood, hive gets 3 frames more bees from brood. When the box is almost full of bees, after a week you have it full of brood.

Small colonies are very sensitive to cold.

 

[itma]

But isn't the whole idea of feeding them to encourage them to draw out the foundation?

Not exactly.
Fuel is necessary for comb drawing. But bees just store excess.
You can 'encourage' comb drawing by careful (minor) frame rearrangements - for example turing round a frame with only one side being drawn.
Fuel is more of an enabler than a stimulant.

…
The concept of 1:1 is an ancient one and actually relates to a pound of sugar to a pint of water - which works out closer to 45% sugar by weight.
Thin syrup, ideal for immediate consumption, simulating a nectar flow, is what best aids and promotes comb-drawing.

The stronger the syrup, the greater the propensity for the bees to store it.
…

In the Autumn, you may need to bolster the bee's reserves to ensure they have enough to last through Winter.
But right now, you just need to make sure that they have enough to get them through to the next inspection (in the event of bad weather and no forage). For a small colony, a single frameful of stores (in total) is plenty reserve. Beyond that, you are making problems for yourself.

Ahh. So its a bit of a balancing act. A matter of checking if they have sufficient stores and plenty of available forage I assume. So best only to feed when stores are low or bad weather persists?

Check the amount of stores, for the size of the colony. You shouldn't be feeding if they have plenty stores - you'll only 'encourage' more storage if you feed excess.
"Encouragement" by manipulation is something best discussed over a real hive - its not essential, has dangers if done badly, but can be a benefit. It is a balancing act, and one the new beek has no experience of. A mentor, looking at your colony with you, can be a great help.

 

[drex]

Ahh. So its a bit of a balancing act. A matter of checking if they have sufficient stores and plenty of available forage I assume. So best only to feed when stores are low or bad weather persists?

Yes. It is always a balancing act. At any time of season.
What do a small colony need most?
More bees.
The queen will only lay enough eggs for the existing number of workers to cope with, feed and keep warm.
If they have a big box some of the heat used on the brood is wasted by heating that whole big box, hence smaller space is easier for them to rear brood. As brood and hence workers increase you add more frames.
They also will need some space for pollen and nectar obviously.
One of my TBH never has much honey in it, but is a very strong colony.
In summary build up the number of frames slowly as they need it.

 

[Dishmop]

Bees are being given more sugar than I am