Delay introduction of bought queen?

[Linda G]

My mated native black bee has just arrived but the weather has turned drizzly and cool here. Would it be alright if I kept her in the airing cupboard til tomorrow when it says it will be better weather? I've given the queen and attendants a drink and put them somewhere quiet for now.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Yes she will be fine
I keep mine in a kitchen drawer. I don’t think she needs the warmth of an airing cupboard .

 

[BeeKeyPlayer]

The advice is sometimes to keep her in a cool place. Compared to? It doesn't say.

 

[Linda G]

Thank you for your answers. I am a bit nervous because this is my 3rd try at introducing a mated queen (over a couple of years) I did follow instructions but the bees didn't accept the queen. I tried introducing a virgin and it was very successful, but when I introduced a Buckfast virgin, they didn't like her. So now, I'm sticking to native black bees. I tried using a special 'fancy cage' as JMB called it, but it was disaster. The colony I want to introduce the new queen to is on double brood and quite strong and boisterous.I have been treating with Formic Pro and plan to remove this first. I don't know where to place the introduction cage in the hive, and whether it is best to remove the attendants or not. Does anyone have any tips to improve my chances of success?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

leave the attendants in situ, I usually find the old queen, kill her and then immediately put the queen cage between that frame and its neighbour.
I'd definitely get rid of that formic pro stuff.

 

[drex]

As JBM. Formic pro and queens sometimes do not mix well. If really anxious, I introduce the new queen to a made up nuc and then unite.

 

[Linda G]

Thanks for the advice. I cannot find the queen, nor any eggs or larvae. There is some older brood but I'm going to have another look for eggs before introducing the new queen. I last saw a queen when I was doing a sugar roll before using Formic Pro and taking off the supers. If I make up a nuc and introduce the new queen, which frames and bees should I choose, and how many? I've had a lot of success uniting bees and I would normally do this but my colonies are all double at the moment and 3 of them appear to be queen less, or broodless, which is why I've bought this mated queen.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

if you are not 100% sure your colony is queenless, you could well be sending this new queen to her death.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I don't know where to place the introduction cage in the hive,

Never in a strong double brood. Make a nuc up from one or two of your other colonies and never ever in a hive unless you are positive it is queen less. You HAVE to put in a test frame and never order a queen till you are sure

 

[Erichalfbee]

3 of them appear to be queen less, or broodless

It's really quite common this time of year. I had two. Test frame revealed not only no queen cells but a new queen strolling around on the introduced frame.

 

[Linda G]

Yes, i panicked when I thought 3 of 5 colonies were going into winter queen less! I saw that Northumberland Bees suddenly had 3 mated back bees so I bought one whilst I could, as everyone else seemed to be selling Buckfast or other nonnative types. Yesterday afternoon I discovered eggs in one colony and brood in another! The strong colony still shows no sign of a queen though. If I can fin a test frame today, I'll put it in. Meanwhile, I will make a nuc from a good colony and put the new queen in that, for now. Thank you very much everyone for all your wisdom!

 

[pargyle]

Yes, i panicked when I thought 3 of 5 colonies were going into winter queen less! I saw that Northumberland Bees suddenly had 3 mated back bees so I bought one whilst I could, as everyone else seemed to be selling Buckfast or other nonnative types. Yesterday afternoon I discovered eggs in one colony and brood in another! The strong colony still shows no sign of a queen though. If I can fin a test frame today, I'll put it in. Meanwhile, I will make a nuc from a good colony and put the new queen in that, for now. Thank you very much everyone for all your wisdom!

You can take frames and bees from three colonies to make up your nuc so you don't weaken any one of them at this critical time of the year when they are starting wintetr preps. They won't fight being thrown in together - just make sure you don't accidentally put a queen in there ... except the one you have bought of course ! There's lots of time for a nuc to build up and you can take it through winter - or - if you find that your problem colony is queenless- unite them.

 

[Penninetrader]

Yes, i panicked when I thought 3 of 5 colonies were going into winter queen less! I saw that Northumberland Bees suddenly had 3 mated back bees so I bought one whilst I could, as everyone else seemed to be selling Buckfast or other nonnative types. Yesterday afternoon I discovered eggs in one colony and brood in another! The strong colony still shows no sign of a queen though. If I can fin a test frame today, I'll put it in. Meanwhile, I will make a nuc from a good colony and put the new queen in that, for now. Thank you very much everyone for all your wisdom!

That appears to be a sound plan, I hopefully have a black on the way this coming Tuesday and I am better prepared for her than at other times, we, that is you and I, will see. Fingers crossed and all the best

 

[ericbeaumont]

when I introduced a Buckfast virgin, they didn't like her. So now, I'm sticking to native black bees

Species or variety of bee is no guide to acceptance or rejection, because bees are variable, the outcome always uncertain, and why books have been written on the subject.

 

[WoodenBeam]

Thanks for the advice. I cannot find the queen, nor any eggs or larvae. There is some older brood but I'm going to have another look for eggs before introducing the new queen. I last saw a queen when I was doing a sugar roll before using Formic Pro and taking off the supers. If I make up a nuc and introduce the new queen, which frames and bees should I choose, and how many? I've had a lot of success uniting bees and I would normally do this but my colonies are all double at the moment and 3 of them appear to be queen less, or broodless, which is why I've bought this mated queen.

Using Formic Pro can result in a broodless period sometimes & in some colonies. Queen may go off lay and/or eggs/young larva removed.
Pretty strong stuff but it gets the job done, I’ve used it for the last 6-7 years & have no plans to change.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Species or variety of bee is no guide to acceptance or rejection, because bees are variable, the outcome always uncertain, and why books have been written on the subject.

In my limited experience Orange bees are happy to accept any queen while black bees are choosy, often rejecting an orange one. This is providing they are in a state to welcome one in either case.There is a divergence of opinion as to whether the receiving colony should be hopelessly queen less or queen less for a minute. Colonies without a queen for a long time but before laying workers develop are not easy either. A push in cage aids an uncertain acceptance but even then some colonies are so determined to make their own they will let the new queen lay, bump her off and raise their own from her eggs. I have once seen queen cells made on the eggs laid under a push in.

 

[pargyle]

In my limited experience Orange bees are happy to accept any queen while black bees are choosy, often rejecting an orange one. This is providing they are in a state to welcome one in either case.There is a divergence of opinion as to whether the receiving colony should be hopelessly queen less or queen less for a minute. Colonies without a queen for a long time but before laying workers develop are not easy either. A push in cage aids an uncertain acceptance but even then some colonies are so determined to make their own they will let the new queen lay, bump her off and raise their own from her eggs. I have once seen queen cells made on the eggs laid under a push in.

I've found the only 'safe' method - and I've had 100% success over the years is to make up a nuc with frames and bees from 2 or 3 colonies and introduce the new queen into them - I usually put the queen in with the travelling cage suspended and let her out in a day or so if they have not already released her.

Introducing a new queen to a big colony that has had a queen in place can be a bit of a gamble - more so if it's a feisty colony. Combining them with a nuc once the new queen is established seems to be a more reliable and less risky introduction.

But - like everything in beekeeping what works once does not always work next time - bees are unpredictable at times. I'm sure that beefarmers with lots of hives have more success than me as a hobbyist and perhaps it's that I worry about my £40 investment more ?

 

[Amari]

Thank you for your answers. I am a bit nervous because this is my 3rd try at introducing a mated queen (over a couple of years) I did follow instructions but the bees didn't accept the queen. I tried introducing a virgin and it was very successful, but when I introduced a Buckfast virgin, they didn't like her. So now, I'm sticking to native black bees. I tried using a special 'fancy cage' as JMB called it, but it was disaster. The colony I want to introduce the new queen to is on double brood and quite strong and boisterous.I have been treating with Formic Pro and plan to remove this first. I don't know where to place the introduction cage in the hive, and whether it is best to remove the attendants or not. Does anyone have any tips to improve my chances of success?

As per JBM, I don't bother to remove the attendant workers from the travel cage. However when I introduce the cage I don't remove the tab which covers the fondant but return a day or two later to remove it. Gives the hive bees more time to get acquainted.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

However when I introduce the cage I don't remove the tab which covers the fondant but return a day or two later

same here - I leave the cage in for 24 hours (ish) before removing the tab

 

[Linda G]

Update! So far, so good! I made up a nuc with a frame of capped brood, nurse bees and food plus 2 drawn frames. Unfortunately, I had already done this before I read I could have used bees from more than 1 colony. I was amazed to hear that you can mix bees from 2 or 3 colonies without fighting. I introduced the cage, without removing the attendants, and I forced myself not to look for 5 days. Not only was the queen sitting calmly on the middle of a frame, she had laid eggs on most of the drawn frames! I'm so pleased and grateful for all the advice given. A few days ago, I decided to move the nuc into a hive, and I took 3 frames of food from a colony with plenty, and added a couple of new frames. I am going on holiday for 3 weeks, so I wanted to help them to build up before winter. I will leave all colonies with food before I go. Meanwhile, few eggs have now appeared in the doomed "queenless" colony!!