Dartington

[hedgerow pete]

firstly welcome to the forum, secondly where are you?????

once we know where you are we can get people to give local knowledge and help if you want it.

The posting says that you are thinking of running a dartlington as a top bar hive, sorry but that does need a little more explaining to us.

a dartlington is a beautiful hive that is made from lots of cut pieces of timber and then filled with frames for the bees to fill and occupy including supers why would you want to build a complex box to then not bother with the frames

where as the top bar hive is alot simpler in its construction and operation but in no less a great hive,

if you explain to us what you would like to get from your beekeeping and what you are avalible to time, time money, physical health etc we can help suggest many ideas for you to think of before the spring

 

[Mike a]

Welcome to the forums Vonclatt

PM sent.

 

[RoofTops]

Vonclatt, you will have big problems if you try and run a Dartington as a TBH. The bees will stick comb to the sides which will prevent you removing the combs. This is why the normal TBH has sides which slope inwards from the top. The idea is to mimic the natural catenary shape of the comb.

The exception to this is the Warre hive which uses top bars and has straight sides but in these the bees are meant to stick their comb to the sides as no inspections are carried out until the hive is taken apart for the honey to be harvested at the end of the year.

Given your bad back and if honey is not a priority I would suggest looking at TBHs as the outlay will be less and a drawback of the Dartington is the very heavy roof, although it can be cut in half.

I am a bit puzzled by all this discussion on what is the natural way for bees to build comb. Although I have seen the very rare exception where they built from the floor upwards, left in an empty space bees will almost always start to draw comb downwards from the roof. In time they have several combs and in the first year the nest is approximately as wide as it is deep - I have seen this best illustrated in a large observation hive where the bees were allowed to draw all their comb freely - no frames or starter strips. If there is any bias it will be the nest will be deeper than it is wide.

Over a longer period the bees will work downwards further, generally with brood rearing being carried out in the new comb with honey stored above. This is best illustrated in the Warre hive where the brood is always at the bottom and the bees are given extra space by boxes being added to the bottom so the they can continue their downward expansion. However, the sideways space in a Warre is a lot less than the space the bees would occupy if they were not constrained - again as I have seen in the large observation hive.

Queens only go upwards into supers to lay in conventional hives when there is insufficient space in their brood chamber and they can escape through the queen excluder or the QX is removed. They would prefer the workers to build comb at the bottom of the brood frames - as they do if given the opportunity with an empty super added below the brood box.

 

[roche]

Over a longer period the bees will work downwards further, generally with brood rearing being carried out in the new comb with honey stored above.

Thats quite interesting - implies a natural brood disease defence mechanism, sort of like a comb change.

 

[oliver90owner]

implies a natural brood disease defence mechanism, sort of like a comb change

It sure is. That is one of the main advantages of the Warre system. The obvious drawback for the production concious beekeeper is the need to draw new comb all through the season if they are expanding and/or storing.

Regards, RAB

 

[Finman]

Thats quite interesting - implies a natural brood disease defence mechanism, sort of like a comb change.

Surely not. That needs lots of belief

 

[vonclatt]

Thanks for the comments guys.

Money (for a change) is not the issue, nor the complexity of construction of the hive (I do a bit of woodwork now and then, lol), nor is the production of honey (although it would be nice) so I guess the reasons for beekeeping are pollination of fruit trees (don't seem to be many bees around here, got terrible crop) and the observation and management of the bees in the hive on natural comb. Oh and a bit of candle making on the side

Perhaps that is a little too romantic but more than anything I simply have been interested for years and plan to put this into action.

Fitness level, ooohh pretty fit I suppose for the average white collar worker. Damaged my back some time ago so can't lift large weights at odd angles, so perhaps I have just talked myself into a TBH or a Warre (with a lifter mind you).

 

[BuzzWorker]

Information on Dartington hives

Does anyone use the dartington hive? Or know about managetment of it? as the internet is scant on information let alone drawings/plans?

Just glanced over the discussions - interestingly balanced! The latest version of the Long Deep hive deals with many points raised. The two poart roof is a great advantage as the two halves of the hive no longerr have to be covered by the same number of honeyboxes - and the heaviest weight is halved.

Sorry some have4 had dificulty getting info. My interest nowadays is in developing community bee gardens (living museums) as after 46 years bkpg can get repetitive. I have given up printing the Manual of New Beekeeping (as I call the system based on using the Dartington hives) but will still send the Construction Information booklet at A5 size for £7 post free or a CD with the Manual and Construction Info and other bits for £10 post free. email me at [email protected].

Robin

 

[Poly Hive]

The Glen hive has 15 frames in the brood box, and I did hear of a version that went to 18, and Glens were commonly run at times on brood and a half. And that with AMM please note.

FWIW I always think queens as being "vertically challenged" and by that I mean they are after getting up stairs at any opportunity whether the brood box is fully laid up or not.

Hence excluders.

PH

 

[hedgerow pete]

to buzz worker

nice to here your still out and about , i have not heard any thing about you for ages

your design is still being used my several people i know of and i still have all the documents and booklets you printed up many years ago.

apart from setting up bees for others do you still have a hive or two at home,

pete