collapsed hive

[nuporter]

Hi- sorry if there are previous posts about this- but just wanted some advice. As above 16oC down here in southampton- thought Id do a quick check on my 3 hives. 2 had busy bees bringing in pollen, one had bees carrying out dead bees . Looked inside this one- there were the first 4 frames full of stores, then 3 frames- empty with dead bees with their heads in the cells, next 2 frames half full of stores with some alive bees and the queen on (I didnt notice any eggs tho may be too early for this yet- I dont know when they are meant to start laying again)- and then finally two frames full of stores. There was a pile of dead bees on the floor inside the hive. There was no signs of mould. Obviously the bees have starved (shame as still 6 frames full of capped stores). I removed most of the dead bees and moved the empty frames to the edge of the brood box. Should I do anything else or just leave them to their chances and inspect again late March? The queen is an unmarked queen superceeded last Autumn- and I presume she's fertile.
Should I feed them although with lots of stores it seems unnecessary. Also- should i put a frame of stores between the two frames with some bees on?
Cheers Nuala

 

[drstitson]

"I didnt notice any eggs tho may be too early for this yet- I dont know when they are meant to start laying again"

anything upto 2 months ago!!!!


advice re the colony - dummy down to nuc size with blocks of kingspan.

 

[Poly Hive]

Quite normal for there not to be brood yet, it is still very early in the season.

PH

 

[Cazza]

Also- should i put a frame of stores between the two frames with some bees on?
Cheers Nuala

Don't think that would be a great idea. If they have stores, why interfere with them any more than is necessary?
Cazza

 

[jallen]

did the same dont worrie about the big looking pile of dead bees just tipe them out and wait got no brood either yet but as said above it is early puls a littel neopoll never hurts

 

[Finman]

.
The basic reason is a cold spell. A cluster has not been one ball. It has been in slices between combs. Food ceased in seems and bees could not move to another place.

You have now "some bees" and an alive queen. We call them "cup colonies" here.

There are alternatives...

1) you must restrict their living base to such what they can keep warm and how much they occupye combs.

If they occupye now 2 frames, after a while you may take some brood from your biggest hive, such a capped brood frame which emerges. So the nuc gets more bees.
Then wait again that you may take again emerging brood to the nuc.

2) if the colony occupye only one frame, its life is difficult. You need to give more bees to it.

One way is to put it on the top of another hive, that it get heat trough the inner cover board.
If you give brood from bigger hiver, a small gang cannot keep them warm and most of brood will die.

3) electrict terrarium heater or something. you must restrict the bee space. Then you give a heater to the nuc. 3 W is enough if you have one occupyed frame. When you give the emerging brood frame, elecrict heating keeps brood alive. You may what ever which gives 3 W.

4) you lift the whole frame which has bee and give it to nuc. - basicly you have a queen and you make a nuc to it. You must protect the queen with cage that strange bees does not kill it.

 

[Finman]

.
Feeding bees does not help because you have there food frames.
Feeding only invite robbers to unarmed hive.

 

[oliver90owner]

There must have been sufficient bees left, to being up to the challenge of clearing out the dead.

You have likely further reduced their chances of survival by pulling the hive apart, but Finman is an expert with small colonies, in a much harsher enviroonment than here, and his suggestions are good

I would not be presuming the queen is fertile - I would be hoping!

Is the floor an OMF? - clear away the dead bees with a bent coathanger, or similar and close up the floor if OMF.

Is there top ventilation of any kind - if so, close it up.

If there is a feed hole in the crownboard I would invert an insulated container of fondant over the hole as per 'previous-thread' advice on the subject.

The top of the crownboard would be thick with insulation over and also I would be strapping insulaton to the hive sides, if a timber hive.

Warmth is paramount to their survival.

 

[Finman]

.
I just digged my last hive from snow. To 4 hives I put 6 W electrict heater. Next day bees were around the heater. That I did when cluster was only 2-3 frames.

Now I finally noticed what varroa does to my hives. Even if it does not kill the hive, it seems to kill 50% of my normal cluster size. This is a new phenomenom and connected to using Oxalic Acid.

Previous stuffs were used earlier in Autumn. OA is used when varroa has done allready its dirty job.

I have not used August treatment which protect winter brood production and just emerged winter bees.

Red clover encourage to make big winter clusters but now it makes possible to douple mite load during September - and without treatment. 500 mites move to 1000 mite critical level so easily.

Lazy old fart, something to learn again. But it takes its own time to convince myself...

.

 

[nuporter]

cheers guys. I will move them to a nuc asap and add brood at a later date. Weather very warm here in Southampton today (23oC)- and I noticed bees flying into this hive bringing pollen. There were two frames of bees yesterday. They are on a OMF - so will change this.
Thanks again for advice Nuala