Alternative to association membership of bbka

[Summerslease]

What a pack of cheapskates. The increase equates to half a jar of honey ( at my price). The BBKA is the national voice for beekeepers to government and other national organisations. If you aren't a member then you're getting a free ride at others' expense. You are free to do that of course but there's a word for it.

 

[roche]

What a pack of cheapskates. The increase equates to half a jar of honey ( at my price). The BBKA is the national voice for beekeepers to government and other national organisations. If you aren't a member then you're getting a free ride at others' expense. You are free to do that of course but there's a word for it.

I no longer support the BBKA - It has a long history of a lack of transparency in its dealing with the pesticide industry in particular, and a lack of spine when it comes to dealing with the government. Until that changes, I won't be back. (And before it is raised, the "change from within" argument won't wash - I tried that).

It does provide some good basic education (matchsticks aside) but the primary benefit for most members is third party insurance cover for public and product liability. My experience is that this is either expensive or difficult to get for individuals or associations.

Lastly, the waste of money on the BBKA news, and the under utilised national headquarters make me think that the administration and direction leaves a lot to be desired.

 

[alanf]

The BBKA is the national voice for beekeepers to government and other national organisations.

Everyone is entitled to a view and if just representing the interests of beekeepers was what the BBKA concentrated on there would be fewer objections.

• No longer sponsored by Bayer, but still encourages corporate support, a compromised "national voice" at best.
• The monthly newsletter appears to have been established to compete directly with Beecraft, direct assault on the advertising revenue at any rate. Is that a reasonable use of membership subscription?
• A substantial part of the rise is for monthly postage, changing the frequency, size or distribution of the magazine does not seem to have been considered as an alternative. Is supporting the Royal Mail that important?
• There has been considerable "investment" in the commercial side, duplicating the range of existing suppliers and selling imported plush toys. Little prospect of significant revenue in return while it damages traders and fund raising elsewhere.
• Considerable "investment" in the web site and forum, which gets far fewer visits than independent sites like this one.
• Adopt a beehive? Raises some money but many would see local links and education support as more effective public education.
• For a membership organisation, they volunteer little information directly to the membership. Why aren't the annual accounts on the website? Minutes of delegates' meetings?
• Much of the effort appears to be directed at maintaining central headquarters and staff. Overheads are inevitable but organisations often end up with a "tail wagging the dog".
• I don't think many object to the idea that a national body should take on education and training, but as far as I recall the examination costs are largely covered by separate fees and sale of materials. Similarly, conference and exhibition fees cover the costs.

WBKA and SBKA do a similar job without the need for the "extras". Seen from a distance they appear to have a more effective "voice" to their national governments than BBKA has with any English authorities. There are many who would prefer BBKA to operate on a similar basis.

 

[itma]

... The BBKA is the national voice for beekeepers to government and other national organisations. ...

Could you please explain to me exactly how you are consulted by the BBKA regarding what should be said to Government and other national organisations?

How would you go about making any change whatsoever in what is being said 'on your behalf'?

 

[Russel]

..... The BBKA is the national voice for beekeepers to government and other national organisations.......

There are many who strongly believe this and the research "program" !!

 

[victor meldrew]

Stick together !
Remember the old adage " together we stand, divided we fall".?
Don't knock, join, don't complain , make the effort and don't give me the worn out " There's no democracy !
For god's sake ,you've more chance of making change from within than from without!
Certainly more chance than changing the professional politicians in the Palace of Westminster !
I don't see much posted on here suggesting an alternative government!
Put up or shut up! This old chestnut is well over roasted !
VM


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[VEG]

Thankfully I dont have to put up with them

 

[Ivor Kemp]

Thanks to all for your input.

It is evident that continued affiliation to the BBKA is not in the majority so it will be interesting to see how our members feel, but the object of the exercise is not to lobby but to provide information so they know there are alternatives out there.

If I have got this right, the insurance only makes up a relatively small part of the membership fee and it is the administration, postage of magazine etc. that takes up the bulk. This is really interesting because it is always the insurance that has made people reticent about leaving.

 

[Russel]

Did you survive to tell the tale?
Our AGM will be interesting, probably a divided camp?

 

[victor meldrew]

Did you survive to tell the tale?
Our AGM will be interesting, probably a divided camp?

A short sighted view in my opinion !
There are a wealth of teaching aids, experience at branch, county and national level .
An involvement with government agency plus a working network from apiary floor to F.E.R.A. and close working relationship with the inspectorate which usually doubles as a teaching platform at branch level .
Constructive criticism , yes but attempts to subvert when all that's needed is involvement, is the wrong way to redress grievances!
Fragmentation leads to loss of clout and is a tactic beloved of all who seek power!
VM


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[Russel]

What a pack of cheapskates. The increase equates to half a jar of honey ( at my price). The BBKA is the national voice for beekeepers to government and other national organisations. If you aren't a member then you're getting a free ride at others' expense. You are free to do that of course but there's a word for it.

A short sighted view in my opinion !
There are a wealth of teaching aids, experience at branch, county and national level .
An involvement with government agency plus a working network from apiary floor to F.E.R.A. and close working relationship with the inspectorate which usually doubles as a teaching platform at branch level .
Constructive criticism , yes but attempts to subvert when all that's needed is involvement, is the wrong way to redress grievances!
Fragmentation leads to loss of clout and is a tactic beloved of all who seek power!
VM


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Hi VM,

Gwent is in the unique position of being the only welsh county in the BBKA and not in the WBKA. Some members have asked why, and why the BBKA capitation is almost twice that of the WBKA, amongst other issues.
In order to answer we've invited both to send representation at our AGM.
No one denies the benefits of belonging to either org but if members query we must address their concerns for what appear to be very similar benefits for less money, in fact the WBKA PL ins is more comprehesive. We'll see?

 

[alanf]

A short sighted view in my opinion !
There are a wealth of teaching aids, experience at branch, county and national level .
An involvement with government agency plus a working network from apiary floor to F.E.R.A. and close working relationship with the inspectorate which usually doubles as a teaching platform at branch level...

Entitled to an opinion, of course. Teaching aids are made available on a commercial basis, much as books and products from the usual suppliers have always been. If materials were made available at no cost to affiliated organisations, that might be a point, but they're not.

Experience exists among individuals and members of many organisations, it's not exclusively owned by BBKA. FERA and inspectors are paid for by the taxpayer, at national or EU level. In any publications or question session, they are very careful not to align themselves with any organisation or none. Initiatives are publicised through all contacts, courses are run on request for any group. They would be just as willing to talk to biobees, non affiliated counties or anyone else who could organise an audience.

The basic question has to be: "what do BBKA provide that an organisation like WBKA does not?" Are any "extras" adding anything worthwhile?

 

[victor meldrew]

If this has been discussed before my apologies.

Our Association has its AGM on Friday and we are discussing the thorny question of whether to remain affiliated to BBKA.

BBKA have just put their Association Membership fees up by £2 per person and many members are rumbling about this as well as their attitude towards the pesticide issues.

The main argument in favour of staying seems to be the insurance, so I was just wondering if other forum users have found alternatives to this insurance, and your feelings on this subject generally.

Many thanks.

I think the Question was general not BBKA versus WBKA.
My posts on this thread all allude the original post
Yes we can as individuals manage quite well without any organisation , we can also pick and choose which or whether to become involved . However ,when a question of comparisons is put, it leads to criticisms both justified and unjustified of the status quo.
When an individuals activities impinge on others , co-operation is to be encouraged , particularly where livestock is involved!
Utopia doesn't exist in this world .
VM


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[Russel]

Well AGM over, BBKA v WBKA debate interesting and heated but no one hospitalised.
Both org's offer very similar facilities to individual members & BKA's.
However the retail,research and lobbying etc side are poles apart, with the wbka run solely by volunteers and the bbka by a combination of paid staff and an "army" of volunteers.
Both offer BD and PL ins within their capitation fee.
The cost inc BDI: WBKA £10pa v £19 BBKA with another increase mentioned
A report on events will be published soon but nothing will be decided until the new year.

 

[Hawklord]

How did the world manage to survive without any insurance?

 

[Chris B]

How did the world manage to survive without any insurance?

At risk of answering a rhetorical question....

I guess in the good old days nobody lived long enough to need insurance. Either that or people just looked after each other a bit better.

 

[Russel]

At risk of answering a rhetorical question....

I guess in the good old days nobody lived long enough to need insurance. Either that or people just looked after each other a bit better.

.... and an element of being responsible for ones own actions