A way to combat CBPV?

[Patrick1]

I am bit late to this thread, sorry.

It seems to me that It is not too stretchy to think that Ants could have an impact on our hives as vectors, they are frequent visitors to most hives and are from the same order as bees Hymenoptera, they may well contribute to many of the transferable diseases.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Some bee viruses have been isolated from ants but replication hasn’t been shown. Varroa carry CBPV but do they infect the bees?

 

[masterBK]

A few years ago I had a few colonies with sac brood and a few with CBPV ( all these colonies were derived from swarms collected from the Doncaster area). These were all re-queened from queens derived from my own colonies that did not manifest the signs of either of these virus conditions. Each subsequent year I have only reared queens from colonies that showed no signs of these and this year I did not have a single case amongst 31 colonies. Hopefully this will continue. I believe Genetic susceptibility pays a big part in the manifestation of viral diseases and in the case of CBPV genes determine whether infected bees show the type 1 or the type 2 syndrome.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I believe Genetic susceptibility pays a big part in the manifestation of viral diseases

You are not alone
I have heard talk of the Danish strain of Buckfast being more susceptible to CBPV

 

[Patrick1]

Unfortunately I ended up with one of the four breeder queens a few years ago that went this way, It only happened one year out of the 15 that I have used the same source.

 

[Murox]

Isn't there some sort of inevitability about that sort of situation; the more we select, refine and restrict genetic variation in creatures, the more likely they are to not only express the desired traits but also various undesirable/unforeseen traits ? We have barely scratched the surface with most genome sequencing to determine the genetic makeup of an organism or cell.

 

[Jules59]

I've now got a hive with CBPV. A large colony (15 frames of brood in a double brood with 3 supers). The previous week I did a nuc AS, and at the time everything looked dandy. A week later a noticed some typical black hairless bees and in another few days the disease took off. It's amazing how quickly this disease escalates from a few type 2 bees to a pile of dead and dying type 1 bees out front and loads shaking on the landing area.
I've decided to try the "no-floor" approach and sealed up the gaps around the WBC base with correx and duck tape after removing the OMF. I have a flap at the back I can use to rake out the fallen bees. This may well turn out to be a complete waste of time but I thought I'd give it a go before I euthanise the colony.

 

[Erichalfbee]

It’s certainly getting more common. If you’re going to give them a chance requeen asap too.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I've now got a hive with CBPV. A large colony (15 frames of brood in a double brood with 3 supers). The previous week I did a nuc AS, and at the time everything looked dandy. A week later a noticed some typical black hairless bees and in another few days the disease took off. It's amazing how quickly this disease escalates from a few type 2 bees to a pile of dead and dying type 1 bees out front and loads shaking on the landing area.
I've decided to try the "no-floor" approach and sealed up the gaps around the WBC base with correx and duck tape after removing the OMF. I have a flap at the back I can use to rake out the fallen bees. This may well turn out to be a complete waste of time but I thought I'd give it a go before I euthanise the colony.
View attachment 31789

View attachment 31790

you need to have the bottom completely open so that the bees really feel that the there is nothing below the combs so they don't need to move the dead away.
I know this whole method is experimental - a hit and miss 'suck it and see' affair but I think what you have done there isn't quite the method envisaged. During the discusson it was made evident that what was needed was a step away from the low stand pallet base regime and to get the brood box well off the floor (12" to 18") so that it is just suspended over a large emptiness, just enclosing a floor less WBC stand is just making their floor, albeit grass covered just six inches further away and undertaker/housekeeping bees will still try and carry the dead away.
Get them on a higher stand so that it is quite obvious the ground is not the floor.
Personally I can't see the logic of then enclosing the whole thing, whether with boards, plastic or whatever. I know some will pipe up 'but wasps' but in the end this is a drastic measure to try and reverse a rather serious virus.
Like in surgery, amputation and the risks involved is sometimes the only way of getting a 'cure'

 

[Erichalfbee]

I have taken the mesh out of a floor so that the bees still have “an entrance” and put an empty super on top then the brood box. Left in place for a month. Requeen straightaway

 

[Jules59]

It’s certainly getting more common. If you’re going to give them a chance requeen asap too.

The sole remaining QC should be hatching in 2 days - will that do?

 

[Jules59]

I have taken the mesh out of a floor so that the bees still have “an entrance” and put an empty super on top then the brood box. Left in place for a month. Requeen straightaway

Thats an easy way to raise the brood box - (though they might fill it with comb in time, but not when they don't have a laying Q). I'll try that and also remove the coverings.
Building something strong enough to raise and support the whole hive will take me a bit more time.

 

[pargyle]

you need to have the bottom completely open so that the bees really feel that the there is nothing below the combs so they don't need to move the dead away.
I know this whole method is experimental - a hit and miss 'suck it and see' affair but I think what you have done there isn't quite the method envisaged. During the discusson it was made evident that what was needed was a step away from the low stand pallet base regime and to get the brood box well off the floor (12" to 18") so that it is just suspended over a large emptiness, just enclosing a floor less WBC stand is just making their floor, albeit grass covered just six inches further away and undertaker/housekeeping bees will still try and carry the dead away.
Get them on a higher stand so that it is quite obvious the ground is not the floor.
Personally I can't see the logic of then enclosing the whole thing, whether with boards, plastic or whatever. I know some will pipe up 'but wasps' but in the end this is a drastic measure to try and reverse a rather serious virus.
Like in surgery, amputation and the risks involved is sometimes the only way of getting a 'cure'

As always ... this forum is well ahead of the game.. experimental it may be but isn't that the way most things in beekeeping start. I haven't had CBPV in my colonies and hope I don't have to experience it but talking to some beekeepers in my association it's certainly in the association area and the advice is still to shook swarm or destroy the colony .... they need to catch up.

 

[Erichalfbee]

The sole remaining QC should be hatching in 2 days - will that do?

Not if she is the daughter of the original queen
You need different genes

 

[cwinte]

I'm about a year in with a bottomless hive, looking strong and about 5 heavy boxes high, though comb extending downwards forced me to nadir an extra shallow box. Feel like I'm probably coming to the crunch time when any virus might take off again so a mild hold of breath... My heavy plastic sheeting cones seems to work pretty well at keeping problems out as well as stopping bees finding short cuts in and out - which make it harder to estimate activity but is probably fine for them.

 

[BrumB]

Not if she is the daughter of the original queen
You need different genes

Not that it will help a colony of this size but I had 2 colonies last year that were showing all the classic CBPV symptoms I treated both with a single tray of apiguard. After reading the suggested link between CBPV and the tracheal mite. Both colonies have their original queens and are filling first supers. I didn't try the floor less method. In fact they were over wintered on solid floors.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Not that it will help a colony of this size but I had 2 colonies last year that were showing all the classic CBPV symptoms I treated both with a single tray of apiguard. After reading the suggested link between CBPV and the tracheal mite. Both colonies have their original queens and are filling first supers. I didn't try the floor less method. In fact they were over wintered on solid floors.

Yea though CBPV is said to be non varroa vectored the mite adds to stress and a colony’s ability to overcome the virus

 

[BrumB]

Yea though CBPV is said to be non varroa vectored the mite adds to stress and a colony’s ability to overcome the virus

Thymol also treats tracheal mites ... I used it for that reason not varroa

 

[Jules59]

This is the best I can do for now

 

[Jules59]

What are people's thoughts on reusing brood and super frames (with comb) from a colony that has had CBPV ?