Would you treat?

[MuswellMetro]

I manage over 30 hives. I check for varroa drop regularly. This year none have shown any significant drop - only one or two on tray after a week and non showing up when drones are culled. I have struggled to find any varroa to show the students what they are.

I noticed the ants have done well this year and a lot of the varroa trays have ants on them and the ants seem to carry off the varroa??

Anyway, thymol treatment put on all of them and on Sunday, one of them, that seemed no different from the others, showed a drop of about 200. I am losing confidence in the varroa tray method of establishing drop.

I don't think the Autumn thymol treatment does much harm. Jury is still out on oxalic acid in Winter. It seems to have a worse effect on smaller colonies?Think I will not treat the nucs with oxalic, but instead give them an additional Spring thymol treatment.

i think it could be natural selection of varroa that for what ever reason don't fall off, perhaps the mites bury themselves deeper under the tergite and stay in there even when dead so getting removed with the dead bee rather than falling off

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Varroa Count - Day 6 of Treatment + Robber Screen

On the 6th day of HM's Thymol treatment on my 14 x12 hive that houses an early June swarm and there was a mite drop of 8, thus giving a total over 6 days of 69 Varroa.

The Robber Screen was still not working well with returning foragers not being able to find the way in. At dusk I took it off again and made changes so that the mesh stood further off the hive and gave a bigger gap between the Screen frame and the ramp of the hive entrance. I'll see in the morning how it's working, in terms of foragers getting back into the hive - it's working as far as the wasps are concerned. I'm struggling with being able to differentiate between returning foragers and robber bees - if only the robbers wore masks and carried a bag marked "Swag"!

CVB

 

[Erichalfbee]

I was at my BKA honey fete yesterday and talked to lots of beekeepers. ALL are reporting little varroa and MOST are not treating. I wonder what Spring will bring?

 

[Nige.Coll]

does everyone use the varroa calculator on bee base as a guide to treatment ?

 

[charlievictorbravo]

I was at my BKA honey fete yesterday and talked to lots of beekeepers. ALL are reporting little varroa and MOST are not treating. I wonder what Spring will bring?

I had had quite low drops of mites on the inspection board leading up to the treatment but I was persuaded to treat by Finman's insistence that, even if they are not on the board, they are there.

In addition, somebody suggested that ants and earwigs will carry off mites from the board, which does rather call into question the accuracy of the Varroa counts.

Lastly, I thought that if I did a full Autumn treatment, I might be able to get away without treating with the more aggressive Oxalic Acid in the middle of winter.

CVB

Incidentally, Erica, did any of your BKA colleagues have any reasoned theories as to why the Varroa were less this year than previous years?

 

[Tom Bick]

I have bees on three sites two have good populations of ants and regularly see them on the trays and my third seemingly few or no ants. This hive on the third site has shown little mite problems over the year, until that is I apply the 2nd thymol treatment and the tray had a few hundred on it. So they are there.

Personally I think all insects have had a good year including the ones that like to scavenge off the trays.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Incidentally, Erica, did any of your BKA colleagues have any reasoned theories as to why the Varroa were less this year than previous years?

Ah...... I did ask and mostly got a shrug.A few mentioned having a brood break and some thought they had resistant bees ??

 

[Swarm]

Hmmm, somehow I think they should still treat.

 

[Erichalfbee]

So do I.....especially the ones near me!

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Varroa Count - Day 7 of Treatment + Robber Screen Success

On day 7 of the HM Thymol treatment, I had a drop of 9 Varroa mites, all, as far as I could see, dead. The total since the beginning of the treatment is 78 mites.

I won't do an inspection this week but will wait until next week when the second phase of the treatment starts - will be interesting to see if a fresh dose of Thymol brings down a lot more Varroa, as in day 1 of this phase.

As the the saga of the Robber Screen, the combination of my adjustments and the bees learning their way home, behind the screen, seems to have solved the problem of bees outside the screen at dusk. This evening, there were no bees on the wrong side of the screen so that's all good.

I saw an interesting thing on the screen - a bee dragged a dead drone up over the screen from the hive. It did not drop it outside; the bee fell off the screen to the grass underneath with the drone. Instead of crawling back up to the entrance, the bee dragged the carcass about 15cm across the grass before I lost sight of it. What's all that about?

CVB

 

[pargyle]

I saw an interesting thing on the screen - a bee dragged a dead drone up over the screen from the hive. It did not drop it outside; the bee fell off the screen to the grass underneath with the drone. Instead of crawling back up to the entrance, the bee dragged the carcass about 15cm across the grass before I lost sight of it. What's all that about?

CVB

it

I saw two of my undertaker bees drag a dead bee out of the hive and fly about 4 feet carrying the body between them before crashing to the ground with it ... unbelievable strength and determination ! They are either being excessive about their housekeeping or it's a defence mechanism to get the bodies away from the hive entrance.

I've not treated this was just a 'normal' bee death. I don't see piles of dead bees outside the hive entrance ever. What few there are usually get cleared away by a few wasps who obviously see the few dead bees as a fortuitous meal !

 

[garlicpickle]

There was a family of wrens in my apiary during summer, who I reckon took care of any corpses

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Varroa Count - Day 8 of Treatment

The mite drop on day 8 of HM's Thymol treatment and the drop was only 6 bringing the total since the start to 84 Varroa - not very many.

The Robber Screen is ok but I'm still struggling, trying to find out which bees are mine but lost and which are wobbers - anybody any ideas?

CVB

 

[BeeJayBee]

Could you dust some with icing sugar, and see where they go?

 

[BeeBo]

Like many others here, my pre- treatment varroa drop is nil but have decided to treat anyway.
My question is, if there is a very low or no drop during the first treatment phase, would it be advisable not to do the second treatment.
I'm treating with Apiguard.

 

[Swarm]

No, finish the treatment.

 

[pargyle]

Like many others here, my pre- treatment varroa drop is nil but have decided to treat anyway.
My question is, if there is a very low or no drop during the first treatment phase, would it be advisable not to do the second treatment.
I'm treating with Apiguard.

It's a choice ... if the drop after the first treatment is minimal then you have to decide whether you feel that you are doing the bees more harm or more good by bashing them again ... for sure there will be two completely opposite views on here. I'm probably the wrong person to give you advice as I could find no signs of varroa in my hive ... after constant monitoring of the sticky board, two sugar rolls and two lots of drone capping I didn't find a single mite. So ... I took the (brave or foolhardy) decision not to treat this year. Only time will tell and I'm not going to say you should or you shouldn't ... just that you have a choice.

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Varroa Count - Day 9 of Treatment

The mite drop from day 9 of the Hivemaker's treatment is 10, with a total to date of the treatment of 94.

I was late removing the inspection board this evening and found lots of comotose and dead bees there. They had somehow found their way there, possibly because they have lots of the "stupid" gene and cannot find their way past the Robber Screen. I have therefore removed the screen and replaced the width restriction, which leaves two bee spaces for them to get in and out. I'll keep an eye on them tomorrow.

Beebo - I'm pretty much in the situation you describe - I had a low count on the monitoring board but decided to go ahead anyway. If you read all of this thread you will see that my Varroa mite drop during treatment has not been very high but the advice I have had from more experienced forum members is, as Swarm recommends, finish the treatment. You will catch mites that emerge with brood as it leaves the cell. I have decided to finish the full three phases of the treatment I am using. The next big question is whether to do an Oxalic Acid treatment in mid-winter?

CVB

 

[charlievictorbravo]

Varroa Count - Day 10 of Treatment

The mite drop on Day 10 was only 5, bringing the total since the start of HM's treatment of my 14x12 hive to 99.

Having done more internet research on robbing, I'm having doubts as to whether my hive was suffering robbing - the essential element of fighting on the landing board was missing. I haven't yet figured out where all the honey stores went from the brood box - possibly fed to brood during a June gap delayed until middle of August by the late spring? On the bright side, I now have a robber screen for use if wasps attack, big-time!

CVB

 

[Goran]

The mite drop on Day 10 was only 5, bringing the total since the start of HM's treatment of my 14x12 hive to 99.

Having done more internet research on robbing, I'm having doubts as to whether my hive was suffering robbing - the essential element of fighting on the landing board was missing. I haven't yet figured out where all the honey stores went from the brood box - possibly fed to brood during a June gap delayed until middle of August by the late spring? On the bright side, I now have a robber screen for use if wasps attack, big-time!

CVB

Some colonies aloud "silent robbing". Last year I had one colony which in august had 15-18kg of stores ( which is more than enough for winter here). After two weeks accidentally I opened a hive they run to less 10kg.. Without " fight at the entrance". Also when have wired floor bees come from below the wire and "beg" for food and get it from colony. Here is floor closed during the season and opened in winter until the brood starts ( I have solid floors). August is here considered as time when silent robbing increase.