why

[ugcheleuce]

What actually is the size of a national brood and super box in mms?

Surely it depends how you want to keep your bees... [etc.]

Why you ask this?

I suspect Paul's reply wasn't a response to your message but to my message.

 

[yeogi75]

I have been looking over the plans in a book I got (building beehives for dummies) and have noticed that the national hive would be alot more complicated than the langstroth hive for the diy-er. The reason why I say this is that on the national hive we have the hands rails but with a few difficult cuts rather than have just the finger joints that's on the langstroth and have a rabbet cut so the frames can sit on.

I'm just curious as to why this is. Wouldn't it be easier just to follow the same construction method of the langstroth but with the interior measurements of the national.

the reason for rail top and bottom is for lifting, and rails for frames to sit on and to make bottom bee space, lots that don't really rely on rails out side, all can be done as you say square box out side, rebate tops screw inner board on the inside attach frame guide job done, but all that will increase the overall weight, but you don't lift the brood box every time you inspect do you, you might not even lift anytime and if you do remove the frames and put in new box and clean old one ready for next time

 

[REDWOOD]

What actually is the size of a national brood and super box in mms. When one rests its frames in the boxes, how much space is there between the next frame on top and even the sides

~Here is a list of sizes
http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=856

 

[REDWOOD]

I have taken interest in the Buckfast design, It has 12 frames

 

[ugcheleuce]

I have taken interest in the Buckfast design. It has 12 frames.

If I understand correctly, a simple reboot of the Buckfast Modified Dadant would essentially be a 50 cm x 50 cm box built using 2.5 cm thick wood on all four sides, with the "brood" box being 30 cm high and the "honey" box 15 cm high. Is that right?

 

[oliver90owner]

Spaces to the precision of 0.01mm?

There are some who need to get in the real world. Nobody anywhere is ever going tmake any box to that tolerance and maintain those tolerances once bees were in situ. Just cloud cuckoo land figures. The nearest millimetre is good enough, let alone one hundreth of a millimetre!

 

[ugcheleuce]

Spaces to the precision of 0.01mm? ... Nobody anywhere is ever going to make any box to that tolerance and maintain those tolerances once bees were in situ.

I agree.

 

[Travelator]

I think the construction of Nationals is pretty much dictated by the decision to use long lugs and bottom bee space. As it is following the same constraints, the WBC inner box is pretty similar to the national.

Likewise, the construction of Langstroths is dictated by the choice of short lugs and top bee space. And again, because it follows the same constraints, the Smith hive uses the same construction as the Langstroth.

The exact dimensions of all box types are pretty arbitrary and may (or may not) be based on what lumber sizes were commonly available in the 19th century.

 

[REDWOOD]

Spaces to the precision of 0.01mm?

There are some who need to get in the real world. Nobody anywhere is ever going tmake any box to that tolerance and maintain those tolerances once bees were in situ. Just cloud cuckoo land figures. The nearest millimetre is good enough, let alone one hundreth of a millimetre!

I build mine spot on

 

[REDWOOD]

If I understand correctly, a simple reboot of the Buckfast Modified Dadant would essentially be a 50 cm x 50 cm box built using 2.5 cm thick wood on all four sides, with the "brood" box being 30 cm high and the "honey" box 15 cm high. Is that right?

Correct, I do like the roofs with the double slop and yet still lies flat upside down when doing inspections. Frames were simply spaced with pan head screws

 

[oliver90owner]

I-think the construction of Nationals is pretty much dictated by the decision to use long lugs and bottom bee space

Really? You are welcome to think whatever you like, but try thinking a bit about top bee space. All my Nationals are top bee space - which kinda blows a hole below your water line, I think?

 

[Travelator]

I-think the construction of Nationals is pretty much dictated by the decision to use long lugs and bottom bee space

Really? You are welcome to think whatever you like, but try thinking a bit about top bee space. All my Nationals are top bee space - which kinda blows a hole below your water line, I think?

The point I was trying to make is that if the national was originally conceived as a top bee space hive, the construction might have been quite different with fewer "complicated" pieces. However, having thought about it a bit more I've come to realise that top/bottom bee space doesn't make much difference - most of the complexity in the design comes from the long lugs.

 

[Hombre]

@Irishguy, instead of thinking about the height of different boxes, and certainly for Nationals, the difference between the height of the box and the height of the frames is nominally 10mm. Only one measurement to remember.

 

[hedgerow pete]

try watching the video of me building a nuc and use the idea of layered ply wood for the rebated ends instead, all of my nat are made this way. hedgy