Why are we paying VAT

[Nellie]

yes, Don't you?

As it happens, no. On the advice of my accountant which is a shame as I had a huge pile of receipts that I was ready to wave at him.

 

[Rosti]

None of us declare honey sales on a tax return. We might declare profit from honey sales ... and when you take into account fuel, hive gear, sugar, associated equipment, extraction, proportion of house overheads, have I mentioned bee costs? etc the chances of an amateur 'hobbyist' breaking even let alone having the problem of declaring a profit from keeping 4-6 hives within 5 yrs of start-up is at best remote!

 

[PaleoPerson]

None of us declare honey sales on a tax return. We might declare profit from honey sales ... and when you take into account fuel, hive gear, sugar, associated equipment, extraction, proportion of house overheads, have I mentioned bee costs? etc the chances of an amateur 'hobbyist' breaking even let alone having the problem of declaring a profit from keeping 4-6 hives within 5 yrs of start-up is at best remote!

Profit?????

I thought I was being ambitious thinking it would be a [near] self financing hobby!

Now where did I put that catalogue........

 

[Nellie]

That was pretty much what the accountant said. I was concerned that my home address is also my business address and I didn't want honey labels getting me into trouble with the tax man. I was kind of secretly hoping he'd say put it on the company books after three years outlay on kit, expansion etc.

 

[Rosti]

I thought I was being ambitious thinking it would be a [near] self financing hobby

Paleo, you have been looking at my special list of justifications I save for my wife (thats equates to No:4, always a favourite "this honey has cost us nothing!").

We have a great arrangement; I open her wardrobe and find new clothes which she explains have been there for months. She opens the garage and I say Oh, that old bit of wood, no knocked up out of old scrap pallets.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

If you are VAT registered in your own name for 'another' business you don't need to register again for the bees (in fact you can't) if you consider the bees a business you just include that on your vat return (sales as well as purchases) that way you can get the vat back on all your expenses (including fuel etc.) Raising the VAT limit will make no difference as you'll have to pay VAT however small your business is - it just means you don't have to register if you don't want to

 

[Rosti]

If you are VAT registered in your own name for 'another' business you don't need to register again for the bees (in fact you can't) if you consider the bees a business you just include that on your vat return (sales as well as purchases) that way you can get the vat back on all your expenses (including fuel etc.) Raising the VAT limit will make no difference as you'll have to pay VAT however small your business is - it just means you don't have to register if you don't want to

Unless your 'other' business is registered under the flat rate scheme
- sadly you are then limited to single items (concurrent purchase group items) of a capital nature and £2k or greater (inc VAT) so honey consumables / packaging not admisable and thats a hell of a lot of capital kit for a single hit!

 

[Dishmop]

It would be extremely hard to make a profit.....

I mean... you had to buy some more bees because the last lot swarmed, so the profit you made from selling honey went towards buying the replacement bees.... and then there there was the case of jars that fell off the bench...

the woodpecker which ruined three hives....

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I'll bow to your superior knowledge on that one - It' been 20 years since i worked in vat - we didn't have flat rate schemes in those days

 

[nelletap]

A lot of green initiatives - such as ground source installation - carry a vat of 5%. Beekeeping would fit nicely with this.
Tricia