What's happened all of a sudden

[Batcher]

I visited a mate who had five swarms from two hives over two days. I got the phone call whilst I was checking my hive in the garden. Saw the queen but no swarming activity. Happy with my inspection, I made my way to my mates house. We got two (cast) swarms. I helped check his hives. 1 had no eggs or open brood, but a fair amount of sealed brood. Although we found no queen, we hoped there is one in there. No evidence of an opened queen cell.
The second hive showed the same, although we found 2 charged queen cells. we split these, putting 1 queen cell and frames of brood and stores into each. Hope we did the right thing.
I said earlier that I was happy with my hive, but at 13.00 they swarmed. Happily I got these into a new hive.
Any comments n what we have done right or wrong welcomed.
Thank yo.

 

[enrico]

Hi, not far from you and swarms are rife. It is so easy to miss queen cells so don't beat yourself up over losing a swarm. I have years of experience and have had two this year already, one I hived and one went over the hills towards you! There are many methods of swarm control and it is up to you which suits your methods best! The most important thing is after a swarm, you must go into the hive they came from and go through each frame making sure you leave only one queen cell, that stops casts. I try and leave one I can see is charged and not necessarily a capped one. It is good to know there is something in there. Well done for recovering your swarms and casts. What you are doing is perfectly adequate!
E

 

[Batcher]

Update,
Went to the apiary early last evening. The NUC that I put a charged queen cell in seems to bringing back pollen, so happy with that. The bees in the hive that was on double brood with no sign of a mated queen have now occupied the super and there seem to be lots of bees in there so I added a second super. I am hoping there was a virgin queen there. I was not able to inspect. And this is the reason. The full hive that had swarmed and left two queen cells are terrible. No bees in the super. Looks like lots in the brood box, but they attacked and attacked, even when I was trying to inspect the next hive. Hundreds of 'em. Even followed me back to the van... 30 odd yards. I am convinced they have not brought the queen cell to fruition and are queenless. Should I add a frame of eggs or get a mated queen?
What a season!!

 

[enrico]

Wow! They sound rough! Try a frame of queen cells ASAP. You are lucky they are remote and not causing others problems, I couldn't be doing with that, they would have to go I am afraid!
E

 

[Batcher]

I agree Enrico, but I would like to give them a chance. Not sure, with all this swarming, if I have spare queen cells. Will return tomorrow. Thanks E.

 

[angeJ]

When you say 'they would have to go' - what do you actually mean by that?

 

[ratcatcher]

When you say 'they would have to go' - what do you actually mean by that?

squish the queen and re queen with a more docile one I would think?

 

[Teemore]

If you drop a test frame of eggs and larvae into the angry hive and they draw out emergency queen cells on it, it will confirm they are queenless and you then have the option of allowing one of these emergency queen cells to emerge or, break them all down and unite the Nuc back onto this colony, preferably once you have a confirmed mated and laying queen in it.

 

[Batcher]

Thanks Teemore. Its a good point. The NUC seems calm and are bringing in pollen, so I think that could be the way to go. Due to rain, will have to wait until Sunday untill I will be able to open hives again. Would it matter whether the Queen is on the top or bottom of the uniting process?

 

[enrico]

Preferably on the top but it doesn't really matter. Do you want your queens mated with drones from a Nasty queen though?
Just a thought
E

 

[Margaret Elisabeth]

Preferably on the top but it doesn't really matter. Do you want your queens mated with drones from a Nasty queen though?
Just a thought
E

Although I am a relative newcomer to bee keeping I have to correct this misogynistic Queen blaming that goes on here.
The genes imported from local males have more to do with nastiness than the old Queens daughter's genes.
Genes The old Queen was producing fairly calm bees so her daughter Queen would be calm too.
A new Queen mated in a different area to the mother will have brood with a different gene pool to her mother.
Last year my new Queen in hive 2 mated with the local mafia and the brood had the temperament of hatchet warriors. An unfortunate mating is the problem, not a nasty tempered queen.
Also it is generally well known that a Queenless hive is likely to be more defensive than one with a laying queen (Queenright) I would have thought that it would be more usefull to have given this information first before launching into your useusal Nasty Queen routine

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

The genes imported from local males have more to do with nastiness than the old Queens daughter's genes.

Mayhap - but it's the queen who mates with them - and lays the eggs with their genes in. It's a heck of a lot easier finding a queen and dispatch her than catching every drone within a ten mile radius and squishing them!

 

[Batcher]

One of my hives that swarmed has made numerous queen cells, so I am going to transfer a frame with some on to my hive that I think is queenless. Hope this works.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Carefully cut one of the better capped QC's out (leaving plenty of spare comb around the top end of it) then put that into your Q- hive - using the spare lug of wax, just squeeze it onto the middle of a frame in the centre of the hive

 

[Batcher]

Thanks jenkinsbrynmair. Good plan.