What to do After Harvest?

[Stickyfingers]

Looking ahead what happens after the harvest? Your removing supers and reducing space dramatically, so.....

Guess the question is, is there an opportunity to set a nuc to get ready for winter with surplus bees?

 

[Poly Hive]

Not really.

PH

 

[REDWOOD]

What I do is exchange a full super for an empty one as you might get a late flow, after that bottle your honey thank your bees and fill your boots with honey

 

[ratcatcher]

Guess the question is, is there an opportunity to set a nuc to get ready for winter with surplus bees?

unless you have spare queens,nope, and even then, surely you'd want to do this in summer when they have a chance to build up reserves

 

[Samuel]

This is a very interesting point- the bees in the super at the end of July will not be the bees that overwinter the colony. So hypothetical if you were to shake them or blow them from the super into a new hive on a new location, feed and wait a day or two then Introduce a mated queen you could set up very strong new colonies that are very likely to accept the queen . As the existing hives will also be feed there doesn't seem to be a problem with this method other than finding the time to coordinate it at the most busy time of year in between extracting, feeding and going to the heather. These are the only reasons I have not tried it yet........

However I would not make nucs at this time of year the conventional way ie taking brood etcetc.
If you do try it please let me know how you get on

 

[Stickyfingers]

Samuel this was along the lines I was thinking. Taking it one step further removing full supers with bees and placing on new brood box with a clearer board so rather than shaking let them walk in.

 

[oliver90owner]

conventional way ie taking brood etcetc.

Yes, as always there are more ways to do the job than 'conventional'.

Bought in queens - no bother.

There will still be a lot of supercedure going on well into September and, if anything like last year, possibly much later than that.

So even the 'conventional' way is still possible - just that one can't guarantee the outcome.

Feeding fondant all winter is no real problem. There were lots doing it with full colonies, as well as nucs, last year.

Swarming season does not appear to have waned even now.

A two colony owner might just get away with it, but I wouldn't be recommending it to them as a reliable method. But there again their colonies could be on double broods and they may have plenty of spare emerging brood to boost a nuc....so who really knows.

 

[Samuel]

The reason I would shake is that I would remove supers of honey from the equation as this can only confuse the issue. Also this means you can add bees from another colony to boost the strength necessary. If done like this they will loose their identity very quickly and gratefully accept a queen in desperation after a day or so. (in theory)

 

[Samuel]

I always thought to use leftover queens from the years breeding this way... Just haven't got any leftover this year and as the weather was so poor I didn't use mini nucs just put queen cells into full nucs

 

[oliver90owner]

Yep, you can bet the queen breeders and rearers will still be grafting away

 

[Andy Duff]

Yep, you can bet the queen breeders and rearers will still be grafting away

 

[mbc]

This is a very interesting point- the bees in the super at the end of July will not be the bees that overwinter the colony. So hypothetical if you were to shake them or blow them from the super into a new hive on a new location, feed and wait a day or two then Introduce a mated queen you could set up very strong new colonies that are very likely to accept the queen . As the existing hives will also be feed there doesn't seem to be a problem with this method other than finding the time to coordinate it at the most busy time of year in between extracting, feeding and going to the heather. These are the only reasons I have not tried it yet........

However I would not make nucs at this time of year the conventional way ie taking brood etcetc.
If you do try it please let me know how you get on

Interesting idea but on second thoughts its a sure fire way of pushing up your winter losses and if you're going to collect lots of surplus bees surely they'd be better "spent" shaking them out amongst the hives at the heather.
Nuc production must be more sustainable at a time of year when sometyhing can be done with the bees if it goes wrong.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Looking ahead what happens after the harvest? Your removing supers and reducing space dramatically, so.....

Guess the question is, is there an opportunity to set a nuc to get ready for winter with surplus bees?

A good way to get more winter bees is to put a frame of foundation in the middle of the brood nest after you've done your varroa Tx?
I tried this last year in two colonies; drawn and laid in nicely....

 

[Dusty Rhodes]

Going back a step, how much do people leave for the bees for winter?

On a strong colony on 14x12, would one full super be sufficient?

Dusty

 

[Tom Bick]

Its with most things Dusty it will depend on the colony but I would say a 14x12 BB with plenty of stores should not require any extra stores to over winter.

It is often written that a colony in a standard national BB needed approx 40-45lb of stores to get then through the winter. A full standard BB can hold approx 55lb of stores and a 14x12 approx 77lb of stores

 

[Erichalfbee]

My two 14x12s went through last winter with the stores in the box and no extra.

The nat had a part filled/capped super under.
Masses of Ivy here combined with the mild weather meant they didn't need much syrup either

 

[Poly Hive]

Myself I dinna see the foraging bees as surplus to requirements at all, nor are they "free to a good home"

They are needed for these reasons, any one of which will undermine your wintering, or more to the point their survival of it.

They are supporting the nurse bees which ARE producing the winter bees and very few colonies can ever have too many of them.

They are foraging (in their turn) to stuff the brood area as it contracts with winter food.

They are in my view essential for the survival of the colony, steal at your own risk.

PH

 

[Tdf]

Myself I dinna see the foraging bees as surplus to requirements at all, nor are they "free to a good home"

They are needed for these reasons, any one of which will undermine your wintering, or more to the point their survival of it.

They are supporting the nurse bees which ARE producing the winter bees and very few colonies can ever have too many of them.

They are foraging (in their turn) to stuff the brood area as it contracts with winter food.

They are in my view essential for the survival of the colony, steal at your own risk.

PH

and wont most of those bees be short lived after the flow

 

[Dusty Rhodes]

Its with most things Dusty it will depend on the colony but I would say a 14x12 BB with plenty of stores should not require any extra stores to over winter.

It is often written that a colony in a standard national BB needed approx 40-45lb of stores to get then through the winter. A full standard BB can hold approx 55lb of stores and a 14x12 approx 77lb of stores

Thank you, Tom - and Tonybloke for your PM.

Dusty.