Wax moth infector

[Finman]

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wow, never heard. How many have used it?


http://www.bee-vet.co.uk/shop/view/index.aspx/product/b401-3

Treatment

The hive should be treated preventatively for wax moths. An environmentally friendly product, B401, is available that prevents wax-moth infestation. It is a concentrated solution of a micro-organism that kills the moth larvae, and is harmless to man and bee. It is used after the honey harvest and can provide strong efficacy against wax moth right through the season.




-Bacillus thuringiensis spores
The bacterium Bacillus thuringiensis was discovered in 1911 and has been successfully used for plant protection for several years. The bacterial strain of the product B-401 was selected in particular for its activity against the Wax Moth. The bacterium produces spores containing a toxin. When the larvae ingest the spores, the toxin is freed and damages the intestinal walls. This results in the death of the larvae. Adult Wax Moths do not feed and are therefore not endangered by this product. B-401 is harmless for vertebrates (man, livestock) and bees, and leaves no residues in wax or honey. (It is not currently available for sale to U.S. beekeepers.)
http://www.beesource.com/point-of-v...otection-of-honey-combs-from-wax-moth-damage/
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[Luminos]

I have

 

[itma]

One important thing to note is that B401 (also sold as 'Certan') is effective ONLY against the Wax Moth larvae. Not the adult moth, eggs or pupae.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/search.php?searchid=2320653

 

[pargyle]

So why would you use this fungus ? Isn't convention that strong healthy colonies will usually cope with wax moth themselves, without intervention ? So ... if you have a colony that is suffering from wax moth doesn't it follow that there are underlying issues with the colony's health ... and are we in danger of prolonging weak genes by introducing a prophylactic (albeit a natural one) for something that should not normally happen.

I could almost understand it more if it was used to protect overwintering drawn supers etc. but, again, freezing followed by sealing the supers from potential infestastion seems to work adequately.

I don't get it ? Any explanations please ??

 

[Finman]

I don't get it ? Any explanations please ??

You will understand when moth destroys you comb store in store room.
It is awfull and expencive.

 

[alanf]

Seen it used as a dmonstration, And it appears to work, that is it stops further wax moth damage to treated frames. But so would freezing or acetic acid and they are cheaper.

I don't get it ? Any explanations please ??

Niche product, maybe on stored comb if there was a chance of re-infection? It is effective over time while other methods are vulnerable after treatment.

 

[pargyle]

You will understand when moth destroys you comb store in store room.
It is awfull and expencive.

You missed the point ... the treatment appears to br recommended for HIVES not for equipment in store .... See OP:

"The hive should be treated preventatively for wax moths. An environmentally friendly product, B401, is available that prevents wax-moth infestation. It is a concentrated solution of a micro-organism that kills the moth larvae, and is harmless to man and bee. It is used after the honey harvest and can provide strong efficacy against wax moth right through the season.

Which is what I didn't understand ...

 

[Finman]

Which is what I didn't understand ...

That extracted combs are in the store and larvae start to eate them in the store when bees are not protecting combs.

 

[Finman]

But so would freezing .

Freezing works in Finland when comb store temperature is under -7C.

My accident happened when one winter my store temp was +4C and population was not killed By frost.

 

[pargyle]

That extracted combs are in the store and larvae start to eate them in the store when bees are not protecting combs.

So, let's be clear .... YOU would put this fungus in the hive with the bees as a prophylactic against wax moth after you have extracted and whilst the extracted frames/comb are in storage.

Answer is Yes or No ...

 

[Gilberdyke John]

One important thing to note is that B401 (also sold as 'Certan') is effective ONLY against the Wax Moth larvae. Not the adult moth, eggs or pupae.

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/search.php?searchid=2320653

Isn't the point that the larvae are the phase that destroys comb? However if you break the lifecycle loop at any point the wax moth population reduces.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

So why would you use this fungus ? Isn't convention that strong healthy colonies will usually cope with wax moth themselves, without intervention ? So ... if you have a colony that is suffering from wax moth doesn't it follow that there are underlying issues with the colony's health ... and are we in danger of prolonging weak genes by introducing a prophylactic (albeit a natural one) for something that should not normally happen.

I could almost understand it more if it was used to protect overwintering drawn supers etc. but, again, freezing followed by sealing the supers from potential infestastion seems to work adequately.

I don't get it ? Any explanations please ??

What's your stance on immunising babies against polio, diptheria, smallpox etc.? Or are you simply trying to wind up Finman?

 

[pargyle]

What's your stance on immunising babies against polio, diptheria, smallpox etc.? Or are you simply trying to wind up Finman?

Not in the least ... Look at the original post from Finman and look at what he has said.

I am interested in whether he sees this as a prophylactic (and a natural one at that) against wax moth in frame storage ... and equally why, when strong colonies usually can combat wax moth without our intervention, it should be necessary.

I'm not in the least bit averse to the suggestion that it can be used. I'm also very interested in the current experimentation regarding natural predators being introduced into hives to combat varroa.

You are reading me wrong John .....

 

[alanf]

So, let's be clear .... YOU would put this fungus in the hive with the bees as a prophylactic against wax moth after you have extracted and whilst the extracted frames/comb are in storage.

It's not a fungus. It's an extract from a bacteria. Which lots of pharmaceuticals are, or were originally, such as streptomycin.

 

[Hivemaker.]

I am interested in whether he sees this as a prophylactic (and a natural one at that) against wax moth in frame storage ... and equally why, when strong colonies usually can combat wax moth without our intervention, it should be necessary.

Wax moth larvae will be kept in check by a strong colony, but wax moths will still lay eggs in any nook and cranny they can, the bees cannot control these, and when the combs are extracted and put into store these eggs hatch and the larvae decimate the combs...have you not seen greater wax moths on the outside of hives on a warm summer evening, usually in pairs...sometimes lots of them, also on any combs they can get to, extracted or otherwise.

 

[Finman]

It's not a fungus. It's an extract from a bacteria. Which lots of pharmaceuticals are, or were originally, such as streptomycin.

It is a disease of wax moth

Like it was in first writing :The bacterium produces spores containing a toxin. When the larvae ingest the spores, the toxin is freed and damages the intestinal walls. This results in the death of the larvae.

It is in cathegory of biological war. Not chemical.
Spore means resting bacteria and when a larva eates it, it becomes sick.

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Here is wider advice how to handle wax moth
http://www.beesource.com/point-of-v...otection-of-honey-combs-from-wax-moth-damage/

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[pargyle]

Wax moth larvae will be kept in check by a strong colony, but wax moths will still lay eggs in any nook and cranny they can, the bees cannot control these, and when the combs are extracted and put into store these eggs hatch and the larvae decimate the combs...have you not seen greater wax moths on the outside of hives on a warm summer evening, usually in pairs...sometimes lots of them, also on any combs they can get to, extracted or otherwise.

Yes. I've seen wax moths ... I even found a single wax moth larvae on my sticky board ... I've never seen any evidence of Wax moth inside my hive, however ... I am aware that Wax moths can infest a hive if the colony is, for whatever reason, weakened and whilst I don't have this problem I was trying to get to the bottom of what/when/how you use the stuff.

But, perhaps I was not making myself clear. I understood that Certan was a product that was used, principally, prior to storage of bits of equipment such as frames, where wax moths could have laid eggs that would incubate to larvae which will cause damage (ie: prior to putting the kit into storage). The OP says that it is used as a prophylactic in the hive - which suggests that you squirt the stuff into the hive ...

So, one last time (and my apologies if I am being a bit thick !)....

Do you squirt it in the hive or do you squirt it onto kit that you have taken out of the hive to put into storage ?

And ... when would you use it in preference to freezing and sealing ?

And ... would you use it on a healthy hive with no signs of wax moth as a preventative against wax moth coming up to winter ?

 

[Hivemaker.]

....

http://www.bees-online.co.uk/downloads/CERTAN_INFO.pdf



[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvSOtKrUvZ8"]How to use Vita B401 (Certan) to control wax moth - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Finman]

.
Pargyle, your thoughts are too complex.

You will undestrand if you have this kind of combs.

It took me 47 years to meet this reality show:

 

[Heather]

Maybe when Pargyle has more hives he may meet more of the problems, and understand. One seen on sticky board??.. bet they are in the hive.. you just didnt find them!!

I do all I can to eradicate wax moth.., freezing , sealed storage etc, but my polyhives have been severely eroded by these damned things. They are insidious, and even if you think they are gone - strip a frame down and there will be a larvae!!

Is Certan ok on polyhives?