Ventilation

[markb2603]

Recently moved my hives onto solid UFE floors. I used scrap timber so the floors are pretty thick - 40mm or so. Brood boxes are poly and I then have a solid 6mm polycarbonate crown board, which I then placed the old poly crown board on top of and finally a poly insulated roof. Throughout the summer, this actually seemed to improve any damp issues (was a very wet summer) but I just noticed the last couple of days now the weather has turned a good bit colder a little bit of condensation in the corners of the polycarbonate and a little above where the bees are situated. What can I do to prevent this becoming an issue as winter goes on? I’ve seen some commentary around matchsticks? I could also always just remove the polycarbonate clear crown boards and put back on the standard poly crown board which has ventilation holes.

 

[Sutty]

Is the condensation where the hole in the poly crown board is?
I don't know how thermally conductive the polycarbonate is but much higher than expanded poly. I suspect cold spots in the corners is because the clear board is cold.
I'd put the poly crown board back on, block the holes & consider another block of insulation on top as well.
Definitely no matchsticks or top ventilation.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

the last thing you need is 'ventilation' in the crown boards. just make sure there is plenty of insulation directly above the polycarbonate crownboards and there are no open holes in the crownboards either - your problem seems to be you have air circulating above the crownboards? do you have any vents in the roof? they are not needed either

 

[Sutty]

Having initially thought they were rubbish I quite like the very thin flexible clear "crownboards" I have with my paradise poly hives. Very thin so not a heatsink, easy to remove, thick poly roof on top.

 

[markb2603]

The poly crown board on top has 5 ventilation holes but I keep them closed up with the disks that come with them. I have some spare 50mm insulation I’ll cut out and place on top of the hives.

 

[hemo]

A little condensation at the corners isn't a bad thing , it will eventually run down the walls or gather in the side wells. Bees will make use of the moisture to dilute stores over winter.
As has been mentioned no other ventilaton is needed with the omf /ufe design.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

As has been mentioned no other ventilaton is needed with the omf /ufe design.

or with a solid floor

 

[ericbeaumont]

noticed the last couple of days now the weather has turned ... condensation in the corners of the polycarbonate and a little above where the bees are

How full with bees is the box? Best outcome is when the box is rammed, and downsizing to match bees & box is a good plan at this time of year.

 

[BernardBlack]

What is everyone’s verdict on crown board holes?

Should they be covered over or left open?


(I normally cover the holes with wire mesh, which the bees cover gradually with propolis. So I assume their preference is to have the holes sealed/covered)

I assume if I left the crown board holes uncovered, eventually they would cover over those with propolis?

 

[Sutty]

What is everyone’s verdict on crown board holes?

Should they be covered over or left open?


(I normally cover the holes with wire mesh, which the bees cover gradually with propolis. So I assume their preference is to have the holes sealed/covered)

I assume if I left the crown board holes uncovered, eventually they would cover over those with propolis?

The bees are telling you what they want - cover them!
A big slab of insulation over that will also help - I'm progressively just fitting a slab in the roof & discarding the battens when I assemble roofs.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Recently moved my hives onto solid UFE floors. I used scrap timber so the floors are pretty thick - 40mm or so. Brood boxes are poly and I then have a solid 6mm polycarbonate crown board, which I then placed the old poly crown board on top of and finally a poly insulated roof. Throughout the summer, this actually seemed to improve any damp issues (was a very wet summer) but I just noticed the last couple of days now the weather has turned a good bit colder a little bit of condensation in the corners of the polycarbonate and a little above where the bees are situated. What can I do to prevent this becoming an issue as winter goes on? I’ve seen some commentary around matchsticks? I could also always just remove the polycarbonate clear crown boards and put back on the standard poly crown board which has ventilation holes.

Nothing wrong with the polycarbonate crown board but it does need to have insulation in close contact (touching) with it. No holes to let valuable warmth escape. A little condensation at the edge is a useful source of water inside during winter

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

What is everyone’s verdict on crown board holes?

Should they be covered over or left open?

covered

I assume if I left the crown board holes uncovered, eventually they would cover over those with propolis?

it's too big a hole so they may try but give up - but some people then wrongly assume that means they are happy with a gaping hole above them turning the hive into a wind tunnel

 

[hemo]

Covered , mine are only uncovered for top feeding.
The LBKA which I use to frequent a few years before covid raised it's head followed the open feed hole mantra all year round and pretty much all other BBKA mantra . They still include shooking each year in the itinery and poo poo OA sublimination.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Covered with a thin piece of plastic and 50mm PIR

 

[Antipodes]

Having initially thought they were rubbish I quite like the very thin flexible clear "crownboards" I have with my paradise poly hives. Very thin so not a heatsink, easy to remove, thick poly roof on top.

All beeks here in Aus. using migratory lid hives use a flexible "crownboard" on the top of the frames...where there is a smallish gap up to the underside of the lid proper. The lids generally come with four holes in them for ventilation, but ventilation doesn't make any real difference to how the bees fare from what I've witnessed and read. That's why there has been argument over it for so long.

 

[B_north]

The lids generally come with four holes in them for ventilation, but ventilation doesn't make any real difference to how the bees fare from what I've witnessed and read. That's why there has been argument over it for so long.

I kindly beg to differ, I think the argument is so long because beekeeping in one area is not the same as another. It is important that a beekeeper take advice from those within their local area especially on ventilation or winter preps.

With us, ventilation is very important and can be key to the bees winter survival. Too much and the cold can kill, too little and the moisture can kill.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Covered , mine are only uncovered for top feeding.
The LBKA which I use to frequent a few years before covid raised it's head followed the open feed hole mantra all year round and pretty much all other BBKA mantra . They still include shooking each year in the itinery and poo poo OA sublimination.

You can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink! Hopefully many of their members have discovered this group and read it crouched under a blanket with ears tuned for a knock on the door by the local stasi.

 

[Swarm]

What is everyone’s verdict on crown board holes?

Should they be covered over or left open?


(I normally cover the holes with wire mesh, which the bees cover gradually with propolis. So I assume their preference is to have the holes sealed/covered)

I assume if I left the crown board holes uncovered, eventually they would cover over those with propolis?

They propolised this gap and then reopened it as Spring arrived.

 

[Rory Fields]

or with a solid floor

Do you run any on solid floors, Bryn? I know Peter Little loathed OMF, and I'm starting to think he was right

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Do you run any on solid floors, Bryn?

a few occasionally - my name's Emyr by the way