Too early for swarm traps?

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Beebe 

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Beebe 

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. Should still work? Anyone had success with smaller traps, say 25-30 litres?
Smart move; trying different configurations may give a better insight into how fussy (or not) the bees are; I think they will like that one. :)
 

Do224 

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Not the best location but I’m running out of options....! About a meter off the ground between the house wall and a little shed with the caravan behind. The entrance is facing east mind you...030F7CC6-650F-4180-8DCF-EBABAE98E663.jpeg
 

Beebe 

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Not the best location but I’m running out of options....!
In order to get locations, I've persuaded friends, a neighbour with a bigger garden than me and the owners of a holiday cottage to let me place a bait hive. I also have a piece of land a few hundred metres away. If I can keep up the pace of assembling them, I'm also getting in touch with a local estate to see if I can put one close to a local riverside walk; last summer I heard a swarm or a very busy nest high in the trees there.

A bit of lateral thinking and asking around should find you a few more widespread locations.
 

Ian123 

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I got my swarm in a 6 frame nuc last year. Wasn't a big swarm but the nuc did the job. This year it is going out as a swarm trap again but with an extra nuc body to give more volume
If you look at some of those YouTube American guys that are quite literally putting up dozens. Some used nuc boxes and report swarms absconding even after drawing comb. A problem solved with an increase in volume.
 

Beebe 

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A redacted letter I wrote; includes a bit of simplified BS :poop: about varroa, just to give a bit of "techno"-justification to cover me simply being greedy for bees; it might work.bee-smillie

"Hello,
My name is ............ and I live at ..................... Amongst other things, I am a beekeeper, and this is a general enquiry about the possibility of me placing a polystyrene bait-hive, (sometimes known as a swarm-trap) at a location within about 400 metres of ..............on the riverside walk to ................. This would be during the period from mid-April until late July. The box would be camouflaged and I propose that it would be fixed on a large tree using lightweight ratchet-straps which would not cause damage. The chosen tree would not be easily visible from the footpath and its exact grid reference and images would be recorded and passed on to The Estate. It would be placed sufficiently high to prevent it being easily tampered with and labelled to indicate both its purpose, a disclaimer regarding the liability of ............. Estates and my name and phone number. The height, weight and materials used would reduce the possibility of the box causing damage in the unlikely event of it falling.
From observations last year I am reasonably sure that there are feral bees in that location. Amongst beekeepers there is a lot of interest in acquiring wild bees with a genetic makeup which enables them to thrive despite the threat of the varroa mite. So the acquisition of such bees after they have swarmed naturally may be very useful in making that genetic trait available more widely through future interbreeding.
I realise that this is a long shot and you can probably do without the outside chance of complication such an arrangement might bring. But if you think this is something which might go ahead, I would be very pleased to hear from you and to provide more detail about myself and the box and the methods described.
With very best regards,"
 

Ian123 

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You forgot the I’ll Chuck in a jar of honey and I’m always on the lookout for more sites😂
 

Lincbee 

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Through my work I’m lucky enough... to deal with estates, landowners and farmers on a regular basis, if it were me I’d be tempted to simplify it a bit and not lean on the BS to hard as they’ll spot it a mile off. I normally find just cutting straight to the point and being honest the best solution and if you can maybe find someone there you can speak to in person.

On the other hand there’s a bit of truth in the old saying “It’s easier to get forgiveness than it is to get permission”. I’m sure if you’re not going too far off a public footpath and it’s inconspicuous enough away from any houses I can’t see it doing any harm😬
 

Beebe 

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You forgot the I’ll Chuck in a jar of honey and I’m always on the lookout for more sites😂
;)... whilst I claim to be a beekeeper, I haven't got much of a track record in keeping the blighters, so I am hedging my bets as regards payback. I suspect that, in this case, some sort of notional licence fee would be asked for.
 

Beebe 

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Through my work I’m lucky enough... to deal with estates, landowners and farmers on a regular basis, if it were me I’d be tempted to simplify it a bit and not lean on the BS to hard as they’ll spot it a mile off. I normally find just cutting straight to the point and being honest the best solution and if you can maybe find someone there you can speak to in person.

On the other hand there’s a bit of truth in the old saying “It’s easier to get forgiveness than it is to get permission”. I’m sure if you’re not going too far off a public footpath and it’s inconspicuous enough away from any houses I can’t see it doing any harm😬
I might use some of that advice, thank-you. I'm avoiding personal contact with the estates office just now as they might think that me visiting their office on a matter so trivial (to them) was undesirable as we, in Scotland, are still fairly restricted by covid regulations.

I'll follow up with a phone call and hope this gives them time to digest the implications of my request.
 
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Should traps be filled with frames or just 1 or 2 iv seen people do it both ways but not sure what's the best, any thoughts
 

Do224 

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From what I’ve read it’s good to have a frame of old comb in there and the rest of the space should be a void to allow the bees to assess it’s size. I use one or two old black full frames and then fill the rest of the trap with frames that have a small ‘starter strip’ of foundation at the top which preserves the void. In some of my traps I just put one or two old frames in and left the rest of the trap completely empty.

I’m a complete novice though and haven’t caught any bees yet!
 

Erichalfbee 

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My bait hives are 14x12 Payne’s Nucs with feeders cut out. Against a wall I put a wired starter strip frame then an old brood frame then another wired frame and full the rest with waxed top bars.
 

Beebe 

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Through my work I’m lucky enough... to deal with estates, landowners and farmers on a regular basis, if it were me I’d be tempted to simplify it a bit and not lean on the BS to hard as they’ll spot it a mile off. I normally find just cutting straight to the point and being honest the best solution and if you can maybe find someone there you can speak to in person.

On the other hand there’s a bit of truth in the old saying “It’s easier to get forgiveness than it is to get permission”. I’m sure if you’re not going too far off a public footpath and it’s inconspicuous enough away from any houses I can’t see it doing any harm😬

I've already had a very interesting reply, direct from the titled owner of the estate. It was written very succinctly and graciously, but turned down my request. Perhaps I should have egged the natural beekeeping argument more strongly as the owner is an admirer of the writings of Rudolph Steiner. Steiner appears to have had strong views against the practise (as in 1923) of keeping bees.

I have replied with equal grace, avoiding trying to do any direct persuasion and have pointed out that my own beekeeping gravitates towards a more natural approach than the conventional. I won't try to do any bee poaching, but still have several authorised locations in mind :)
 

Erichalfbee 

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I've already had a very interesting reply, direct from the titled owner of the estate. It was written very succinctly and graciously, but turned down my request. Perhaps I should have egged the natural beekeeping argument more strongly as the owner is an admirer of the writings of Rudolph Steiner. Steiner appears to have had strong views against the practise (as in 1923) of keeping bees.

I have replied with equal grace, avoiding trying to do any direct persuasion and have pointed out that my own beekeeping gravitates towards a more natural approach than the conventional. I won't try to do any bee poaching, but still have several authorised locations in mind :)
You obviously didn’t tug your common forelock hard enough. 😉
 

Beebe 

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You obviously didn’t tug your common forelock hard enough. 😉
My forelock foreclosed on me many years ago. I had the last word, by thanking said landowner for management practises on their lands which provided plentiful forage for my bees in all directions from their hives. :)

I wonder if I ought to have included the following quotation from a lecture by Rudolph Steiner:

"Bee-keeping is therefore something that greatly helps to advance our civilisation, for it makes men strong"
 
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madasafish 

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My forelock foreclosed on me many years ago. I had the last word, by thanking said landowner for management practises on their lands which provided plentiful forage for my bees in all directions from their hives. :)

I wonder if I ought to have included the following quotation from a lecture by Rudolph Steiner:

"Bee-keeping is therefore something that greatly helps to advance our civilisation, for it makes men strong"

Feminists/lady beekeepers would take exception to that.

I do know he wrote a long time ago but Steiner sounds a real misogynist.
 

Beebe 

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Feminists/lady beekeepers would take exception to that.

I do know he wrote a long time ago but Steiner sounds a real misogynist.
The landowner I'm having a dialogue with is a woman. Steiner appears to have dished out some very complex concepts; I suspect that he was quite difficult man...would maybe have made a great beekeeper. :laughing-smiley-014
 

Murox 

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Feminists/lady beekeepers would take exception to that.
I do know he wrote a long time ago but Steiner sounds a real misogynist.
The landowner I'm having a dialogue with is a woman. Steiner appears to have dished out some very complex concepts; I suspect that he was quite difficult man...would maybe have made a great beekeeper. :laughing-smiley-014
Apart from “anthroposophical” beliefs based on “spiritual science,” Rudolf Steiner's writings ranged from philosophical ideas which are at odds with modern-day psychology and physics, to fanciful trips to other planets. He may or may not have been misogynistic but he wrote some decidedly questionable stuff concerning race, evolution and reincarnation, ( “Folk souls”.) suggesting he was racist and colonialist; he had his good points too.
 

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