The National Uncapper

[MartinBee]

Hi Does it work on deep frames

Yes it does work on deep frames. The limiting factor will be on the depth of the box to receive the frame.
I have measured for your "Deep" frames from the underside of your topbar to the underside of your bottom bar is a max of 270mm with the box we supply. Clearly there is a similar shaped box with a deeper setting, and we expect many Keepers to fix the Uncapper to their own box.

 

[MartinBee]

If you don't put the frames in reasonably horizontal will it chew the Hoffman lobes?

the side bars are untouched by the blades as they fit in the gap between the last blade and the HDPE frame. So unless i have miss-understood your question it will cope with any sidebar without damaging them.

 

[Pembroke]

Watching the videos last night it seemed the younger people using it were struggling to force the frames through as they needed a bit of effort. Is that normal or was it just thick frames?

Also any plans to provide a cover for the bands as in some shots it looked like rubber gloves were in danger of getting caught in the bands / pulleys.

 

[Wilco]

You do need to put some force to get the bottom bars in and out but it's easy to get the hang of.

 

[Anduril]

You do need to put some force to get the bottom bars in and out but it's easy to get the hang of.

Simple Harmony Farms speed was 1 frame every 10 seconds from cut to loading the extractor.

 

[Wilco]

Simple Harmony Farms speed was 1 frame every 10 seconds from cut to loading the extractor.

I think with practice it'll be that or less with this device.

 

[blackcloud]

Wilco; "Hard to be sure if the cut width is adequate for full extraction without such a comparison"

Are the blades on the rollers offset to each other or aligned?
I was thinking if they were offset you could turn the frame 180 degrees and put it back in and get at least one cut over every cell.

 

[Anduril]

There are those who use small cell foundation frames. Considering the measurements that have been deleted, it should still cut for them, but possibly it won't be as effective.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

A bit like the small cell cult in general then

 

[Anduril]

A bit like the small cell cult in general then

I'm glad you spelt that correctly!

 

[roche]

Never patent anything - waste of money. Innovate faster than the opposition and manufacture more intelligently.

 

[Wilco]

Wilco; "Hard to be sure if the cut width is adequate for full extraction without such a comparison"

Are the blades on the rollers offset to each other or aligned?
I was thinking if they were offset you could turn the frame 180 degrees and put it back in and get at least one cut over every cell.

They're aligned but spaced such that they should cut over every cell from what I could see. That was one of my concerns when I looked at it, should be a photo of an uncapped frame higher in the thread. My impression is that Martin and. Co. have put a decent amount of thought into this with good attention to detail in the design. Currently model is 2.0.

 

[MartinBee]

Watching the videos last night it seemed the younger people using it were struggling to force the frames through as they needed a bit of effort. Is that normal or was it just thick frames?

Also any plans to provide a cover for the bands as in some shots it looked like rubber gloves were in danger of getting caught in the bands / pulleys.

Pembroke, Yes well observed. the young people are my 12 yr old daughters, who for the testing purposes are not very strong, or tall and have never used the Uncapper before. After the first prototype we reduced the minimum width between the spindles by 3mm, to help with less well filled out frames. The effect is the bottom bar really engages the blades and it requires a little more force to push and pull the frames. We have now gone into production and have re-adjusted the min gap back by 2mm as a result of the "12 yr old girl" test! As with all new bits of kit it will take a little getting used to, i can now assess a frame and uncap it in less than 10 seconds. I do 9 frames at a time (which all fit in the tray / box) as my spinner fits 9 frames at a time. So the Uncapper is not the slow point in the processing now.

No plans to cover the O Rings. Gloves are an option for the beekeeper, and for me it counters the propolis.

 

[MartinBee]

Simple Harmony Farms speed was 1 frame every 10 seconds from cut to loading the extractor.

Anduril, that sounds about right to me. In our early tests we have been very deliberate and careful, but since i have now passed 50+ frames through it i can identify any frame that requires care and pre-trim it, or apply additional pressure to a sunken area, in seconds. What it means is that your uncapping time is no longer a major component in the whole extraction process.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Aluminium can be food grade

catering outfits will ... have to replace most of their pans

Anodised ali is fine for food and is likely to resist the acidity of honey. Recommendation is to clean wax off with acetone, but that seems like overkill when water usually works. Jimmy is right: washing soda will pit and corrode aluminium.

 

[MartinBee]

Wilco; "Hard to be sure if the cut width is adequate for full extraction without such a comparison"

Are the blades on the rollers offset to each other or aligned?
I was thinking if they were offset you could turn the frame 180 degrees and put it back in and get at least one cut over every cell.

@blackcloud @Anduril The blades are aligned and the gap between cuts is 4.2mm which does open even the smaller 4.9mm cells.
Other than being fast and clean, the third main benefit of this type of twin spindle uncapper is efficiency, which i put into 3 categories:

1. Repairing damaged wax
2. Replacing wax removed in the uncapping process
3. Secondary processing of wax residues

Some context:

1. I believe there is less damage to the comb in the cut and extraction (if the uncapper geometry is selected with skill). This is very hotly contested by a couple of more experienced colleagues who have tested the uncapper, they should not be ignored. We would need a more rigorous systemised test to be definitive, I'll apply for a research grant! but in the meantime we are making improvements every time we learn something new.
2. Much less wax is removed from the frame, and 80% of cappings remain on the frame and re-enter the hive. Some of which is reused in situ requiring less virgin wax to be produced.
3. The amount of secondary processed "honey mixed with wax trimmings" is reduced by a factor of 10. Low volume, easy to deal with and i know that saved me lots of time and messy effort.

This part is not an exact science and will depend on your skills with this and other tools, but I think of it in terms of an energy balance for the bees and the beekeeper. Making a time consuming mess was the catalyst to designing the @NationalUncapper, but like all beekeeping equipment it will find its own audience.
I have carefully re-written this section following legitimate feedback from dedicated Forum participants, for which i'm grateful.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Never patent anything - waste of money. Innovate faster than the opposition and manufacture more intelligently.

Yes...it seems similar stuff is out there already

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I'm glad you spelt that correctly!

bloody auto spell 'corrector'

 

[sean-a]

Looks like a great innovation

 

[hemo]

It may be a good innovation but patenting forget it if similar items ar on the market . China will soon have one on Aliexpress for a lot less.