Super spacing

[Jay60]

Hi
New beek...could anyone give me some advice on super spacing. I have just put a super on after hiving my nuc 4 weeks ago. I am using 3" vertical starter strips and was given some metal spacers, but they are the narrow ones which I guess will give 11 frames in a national super. I am looking to take off cut comb as this is my first year. Should I leave the narrow spacers on until they draw out the comb and then replace with wide ones to get nice fat combs? Do the wide metal spaces give 9 frame spacing? Should i have just put nine frame castellated runners on from the start?
Cheers for any advice

 

[Hivemaker.]

Nine frame castellated is to wide for foundation,ten frame works well,and will give you just about the right width of combs when sealed.

 

[Jay60]

Are there spacers that give 10 frame spacing...I have plain runners on at the moment so spacers might be easier until I get another super box.

 

[MuswellMetro]

Are there spacers that give 10 frame spacing...I have plain runners on at the moment so spacers might be easier until I get another super box.

a super is 422 oe 424mm wide depending on whther imperial of metric wood is used

narrow spaces are 37mm so 11 spaced frame plus dummy
hoffman spaced 35mm frames so 12 fit ( very tight)

wide spacers eare 47mm so end on 9 fit (very tight) of 8 plus dummy

wide spacers staggered for drawing are 35mm so 12 or 11 plus dummy fit

see photos

 

[MuswellMetro]

and having know ust measured on Manley's appear to be 42mm, so i assume that is 10 frame per super spacing

does anyone use them? can the be extraxted in a tangental

 

[Hivemaker.]

Yes manley spacing,or castellated with ten. I use ten frames per super,but gave up on manleys years ago because of the way my bee's love to glue them solid with propolis.

 

[MuswellMetro]

i use a mix of narrows and wides

staggered is get 11 plus dummy and end on( ie just turn the narrow frames around ) i get 9 plus Dummy

i find just using wides at 8 spacing give too much space for the bees and they join combs/frames with a lot of brace comb

 

[Hivemaker.]

Yes you need a really heavy honey flow on eight spacing,and some wide combs to start with,then this spacing is no problem regards brace comb.

 

[Poly Hive]

I do not have problems with Manleys either with my current bees or my previous AMM.

That suggests to me that it is location or bee that is the problem for Hivemaker.

My point is please do not let one example put you off. They are ideal for comb honey, and I also had great success with them on Heather sites.

Oh yes and no messing with spacers....LOL (I hate spacers)

PH

 

[Hivemaker.]

Well dear poly....i won't be moving to another part of the country,and the bee's are just fine, and cut comb is good from any ten spacing....how about that.

 

[Poly Hive]

Dear Hivemaker,

I am not knocking what you do.

I am saying that it is not sensible to generalise from the particular.

Many have great success as you do from spacers, many others have equal success from Manleys.

The problem is what? For me it is spacers I find them a bloody complete pain and have done for many years. From tinplate to plastic they are still a pain. Esp at extraction time.

So I advocate not using them and using the wonderful Manley and you love messing with them, each to their own.

PH

 

[MuswellMetro]

the last time i used castles i ended up in A&E..sliced the top of the marigolds and my gashed my index finger ....had honey with added human protein

if you use wides staggered and end on you can staple them on becasue you never need to move the spacers just change frames though 180degrees..that how my mentor did it in the 90s...but i jest let the girls glue them on with proplis

 

[Hivemaker.]

I don't love messing with them poly....i use castellated in most supers,they go on the hives and come off when full hopefully,no messing in between.

 

[Poly Hive]

Seems to be a southern thing Hivemaker. I was astonished when chatting at Maisemore to hear they used castelations.

Sorry to say but I just never got on with them, had two supers with them and they got bonfired.

Are they common in the south before I generalise from two examples?

PH

 

[mbc]

I've noticed my manly supers seem to get capped far better than my 9 frame catellated spaced supers and since trying 10 frame castellations and getting no better capping % than with the 9 frame castelations I had a think about it and realised it seems to be an insulatiion/enclosure feature of the manleys which get a better % of the frames capped. If you look at a manly super you cdan see that its equivalent to a cavity wall insulatiion sort of effect with the bees building comb right out to the inside wall of the cavity.
This may be boring but I had a minor 'eurica !' moment when I realised this

 

[Poly Hive]

and in poly.......

PH

 

[mbc]

and in poly.......

PH

a bit of pine resin volatiles is ok in my honey but petro
chemical carcinogens ?!!!

 

[MuswellMetro]

Are they common in the south before I generalise from two examples?

PH

most beeks, i know in the barnet BKA and west Hertfordshire BKA use manleys or wide spacers ( 8 to box ( but draw out on narrows at 11 to box instead of wides Only two of us rotate frames or use a narrow mix to get 9 in box)....think we dont use castlest is becasue we all buy thornes New year special super seconds in bulk and they are not rebated for their castles

notice the warp in wsuper side in the first photos...£13 and they second photo...20p for nails and wood off skip..all square cut with 50p worth of putty fillet to throw off water on the bottom bar

 

[Baggyone]

My view of all this talk of super spacing is find out what works for you and stick with it. Mixing and matching gave me a whole load o grief when adding a super today. 3 frames came with the super i pulled off out of the super underneath. keep your spacings the same for your supers.

my two p anyhow.

baggy

 

[Hivemaker.]

Sorry to say but I just never got on with them, had two supers with them and they got bonfired.


You could of just removed the castellations,no need to bonfire the supers. But then i may be getting rid of most of the shallow supers soon,slowly phasing them out,but won't be burning them.