Supecedure or Swarming

[melon]

Hi,
In one of my colonies, there were 4 or 5 sealed queen cells, but the queen was still present. There did not appear to be any very young larvae, so how can I tell if this is supercedure...ie the queen is no longer any good, or swarm preparations..ie she has stopped laying ready to fly......but although lovely weather has not managed to go yet.
I am thinking that they just want a new queen. She was laying beautifully, at the last inspection on 7/8 frames. I don't know how old she is as she came from a swarm of unknown origin last May.
Thanks, in anticipation, for your views.
Melon.

 

[oliver90owner]

melon,

Marginal decision with five cells. Question is how are they constructed? If like acorns away from the face of the comb, they could be supercedure cells. If more like a downwards cell extension at the extremity of a frame, then more likely swarm cells. As she is still there with sealed cells, I would guess that you have a lot of supercedure cells. They could still swarm, all the same, when the first queen emerges, I suppose, with that number of cells.

I would be splitting the Q/cells off into a nuc, as a start, and likely doing an A/S as well, if I were not really sure and only had one or two colonies. In your position, I would be considering which strains were the better bees and going from there.

Regards, RAB

 

[melon]

Thanks RAB,
Most were right at the top of the frame, pointing outwards rather than straight down, but there was one at the bottom of the frame, pointing downwards. I will perhaps AS tomorrow afternoon, if not too late!!
I thought afterwards, I wonder if I damaged her, whilst marking her, using crown of thorns...the other bees get quite irate when I put queens in the cage.
Thanks for your help.

 

[Midland Beek]

Supersedure can be hard to spot if it occurs during the swarming season. When you do your AS you might want to have a close look at the queen to see if there is anything obviously wrong with her, like a defective leg. And also, unfertilized eggs being laid where fertilized eggs should be laid, ie. in worker cells, is an indication of a queen that is running low on sperm, as I am sure you know.

Don't hang around ... get a queen cell sealed over and in the good weather we are having a swarm is likely to issue asap.

 

[melon]

Thamks Midland Beek,
I will ASAP, but can't play with my bees on Sunday mornings, as there are a lot of Joe Public about and I don't won't anyone to get stung. The queen did look lovely yesterday, but I suppose injuries could be internal. Will have a better look this afternoon. I also need to clean up the brood boxes that I took off yesterday, spring cleaning on rotation, and get them cleaned up and scorched....need more spare kit...but the more one gets, the more one wants! I thought I was doing well, as have just combined two smaller colonies, thinking I'd have another brood spare. Also thinking of putting double brood on two more colonies.
Melon.

 

[Midland Beek]

What I have sometimes done is when the bees are constructing queen cells and I haven't had the kit with me to do an AS, I have caged the queen in a Butler cage because Sod's Law says that when you return a day later with your kit to do an AS and find the queen, you can't find her. However, if the bees decide to swarm and find that the (caged) queen cannot come with them, they might kill her inside the cage. I once ended up with a dead queen inside a Butler cage and can only assume that the bees balled her.

 

[melon]

Was quite easily able to spot the queen today, probably helps now I have marked her! She is laying really well....just couldn't see a thing yesterday, as the sun would not shine and the frames are a little darkened....I know I need to change them...it's just never that easy, as they always seem to be occupied. I went with good intentions this spring, new frames all at the ready to find the frames all with brood or stores....

Anyway, I have been able to use the some new frames, as I have removed 5 with the queen cells into a nucleus box....Struggled where to put the nuc, as running out of space. Don't know quite where I am going to put all the other AS that will surely be necessary soon.

Hope they'll be happy for a bit, at least while I have 2 days off!

Don't know if I'd be able to get a queen in a cage. I'll have to practice with some of the other bees.
Melon

Melon.