Right or Wrong or ?

[Millet]

This is the second inspection of the year through working and weather issues, one large uncapped Queen cell charged and many more being made, the bees are on Brood + Half and the queen has also laid in quite a few of the super frames but can i hell find her this year, last year and the year before was easy, maybe her mark has gone or i have a new one in there from late last year.
Brood box and super was full of brood/ larvae in all stages(i never seen any eggs but i am crap at seeing them) and stores more nectar than pollen.
I decided to divide the hive placing the good Queen Cell and brood in a separate brood box and knocking down all the other Queen Cells, i also give the Q + side another super with drawn empty frames from last year.

The new brood box with the Queen cell has five frames of brood and food from the original hive (one of them being a super frame full of brood and food), i will deal with that later, i shook many bees in the new box where i was certain the Queen was not on the frames, i will check in seven days to see what is going on, during all that which took longer than expected the bees where as angry as ever even in perfect weather so if the old Queen has gone her daughter is just as vile lol.

Does that sound like it will work or have i cocked up, bearing in mind i had two jumpers on and two pairs of trouser as well as a bee suit while i was doing all that which has made me a few pound lighter..

Also honey is not my goal at this moment in time.
Regards
Steve.

 

[kevrhcfag]

imho No

 

[Eyeman]

1. You couldn't find the Q?
2. Why not keep it simple and do a mod Snellgrove II or is that what you have done?

 

[Millet]

1. You couldn't find the Q?
2. Why not keep it simple and do a mod Snellgrove II or is that what you have done?

1. No the Queen was not spotted on any of the frames but she is there somewhere as i spotted young brood both in the super and brood box, i guessing she may have been on the inner wall of the brood box because i went through the hive twice.

2. I have not read up on a modified Snellgrove II however i was wanting increase this year and the timing was perfect (i think) when i found the unsealed Queen cell.
The only thing that never went according to plan for the split is i was hoping to Re Queen with a calmer strain but i do not think it is the right time of the year for getting hold of local mated Queens.

Both sides of the split have unsealed young brood so i'm thinking that will be insurance just in case the Queen cell fails or the 3rd season Queen is being superseded, here's hoping it works.
Thanks
Steve.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

one large uncapped Queen cell charged and many more being made,

She's gone - they've swarmed

 

[Millet]

She's gone - they've swarmed

I have two bait hives both with old drawn frames in them and scouts where in and out of the National brood box bait hive for several days not long ago, which has caught no swarm.
Would they still swarm with one Queen cell uncapped nearly formed in the middle of a brood frame, also the full hive was jam packed solid with bees covering just about all the frames containing brood.

 

[Fatbee]

Did you see any eggs?

 

[Uncle Betty]

imho No

Why not ?

 

[Erichalfbee]

You don't have a Q+ box because you couldn't find her. She could be in either box?
I agree with eyeman. Modified Snelgrove 2

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I have two bait hives both with old drawn frames in them and scouts where in and out of the National brood box bait hive for several days not long ago, which has caught no swarm.
Would they still swarm with one Queen cell uncapped nearly formed in the middle of a brood frame, also the full hive was jam packed solid with bees covering just about all the frames containing brood.

if there's that many QC's being made, there's a good chance she's gone, just because you have bait hives out, doesn't mean they'll settle in there.
Within hours - day at the most the number of emerging bees combined with the returners from the swarm if they have settled will make the hive looked jam packed again.
If there were no eggs then I wouldn't have torn down all the QC's.
Have a look in both halves of the split in a few days. If the one QC has been torn down, the queen is in there, if it's still there at least you have a queen growing.
In the 'Q-' side - if the queen is in there, they shouldn't be building any EQC's

 

[Millet]

if there's that many QC's being made, there's a good chance she's gone, just because you have bait hives out, doesn't mean they'll settle in there.
Within hours - day at the most the number of emerging bees combined with the returners from the swarm if they have settled will make the hive looked jam packed again.
If there were no eggs then I wouldn't have torn down all the QC's.
Have a look in both halves of the split in a few days. If the one QC has been torn down, the queen is in there, if it's still there at least you have a queen growing.
In the 'Q-' side - if the queen is in there, they shouldn't be building any EQC's

Thank you for your time and valued information, the split presumably Queen - side is the only side with a nearly fully drawn Queen cell, all the other charged cells i tore down where not much bigger than play cup size, they was young larvae as i said but i need a LED torch to find egg's, the bees are like whippets on the comb/frames and a tad angry and the last time i used a torch my hands looked like something out of an American Horror bee movie or lets say it looked like i had a swarm hanging of my hand, i will man up and have a look in the next couple of days with a torch for egg's and i will also check the Queen cell side of things.
Thank you.
Steve.

 

[Millet]

Did you see any eggs?

No Fatty i mentioned earlier i struggle to see them with out a torch..

 

[Millet]

You don't have a Q+ box because you couldn't find her. She could be in either box?
I agree with eyeman. Modified Snelgrove 2

I know exactly where you are coming from and they could be a slight chance i missed her (i have done before) and she might be in the Queen cell side.
I did however leave young larvae in both sides of the split so hopefully if i have messed up i will get a new Queen cell if it is needed in the hopefully Queen + or - side.
On the Snellgrove side of thing's i have not researched it so i do not have a clue about the procedure.
Thank You
Steve

 

[pargyle]

tad angry and the last time i used a torch my hands looked like something out of an American Horror bee movie or lets say it looked like i had a swarm hanging of my hand,

Steve ... You need some of this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Olbas-Oil-...TF8&qid=1494888797&sr=8-10&keywords=Olbas+oil

A few drops rubbed into your gloves before you start handling the bees and you will find that they stay away from your hands ... works like magic. You only need a few drops so a bottle lasts for ages ... plus - helps if you get a bunged up nose or a rough chest ! Dual purpose ...

 

[Millet]

Steve ... You need some of this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Olbas-Oil-...TF8&qid=1494888797&sr=8-10&keywords=Olbas+oil

A few drops rubbed into your gloves before you start handling the bees and you will find that they stay away from your hands ... works like magic. You only need a few drops so a bottle lasts for ages ... plus - helps if you get a bunged up nose or a rough chest ! Dual purpose ...

Thanks for that and funny enough i have some, i had tooth ache a few years back and i used that stuff on it, it eased the pain but it killed the tooth in the process .

 

[Millet]

Well i have been back into both today it should have been sooner but work and weather played a part in my timing, the new split side had another Sealed Queen cell so i removed it and left the original Queen Cell that i did the split with, if my timing is correct she should emerge in a day or three.

The original hive from what i done the split from is surely Queen - ,no eggs and no brood, 2 good size capped Queen cells where found and around five smaller ones which i removed, i left the two Queen cells this time as my attempt last year with leaving one caused the hive to fail as the cell did not emerge, but by god there where angry, they are defensive anyway but today was something else, they where on a all out attack pinging of my veil and trying to sting my wrists/back and arms.
I had to walk around 50 yard's away with my smoker and tools fully suited up as they followed me for around 15 minuets, i now smell like a kipper with sore eyes from the amount of smoke i used to get rid of them and the poor dog got stung again also, but i still love it..

 

[Millet]

I checked again yesterday and the Queen cell in the split has still not emerged it will have been 13 day's roughly give or take a day or two since it was sealed, another failure no doubt .

The two Queen cells left in the original hive have not emerged either, i am unsure of the age but i would have thought they would have emerged by now.

Can anyone recommend anyone who sells Queens around the North East area because as i predicted i'm up the creek without a paddle, last years or this years Queens will do otherwise i will have to start from scratch again and buy a nucleus

 

[Millet]

Thank you nobodies for your help, when help was needed someone stepped forward and i will be forever in his dept, i thought this place was to help people, sadly i think not unless you have a degree in this and that or in the clique .

 

[bjosephd]

Hey Millet, just found this thread over a gin and tonic after a long day in the sun... yikes... what a battle you seem to be having... I need to scroll back another day to read it all more fully.

Exmoor Bees and Beehives seem to still have queens and they send next day delivery a couple of days per week. Maybe worth a try? It seems requeening with some brand new and more docile genes would at least calm the situation - as long as you don't introduce your new queen into a q+ hive accidentally. Test frames needed maybe?

You kipper comment made me actually 'lol' as the kids say.

The increased angriness suggests to me some kind of queenlessness maybe?

You can get a queen pheremone product from various bee supplies that mimic the presence of a queen... I wonder if something like that might calm the situation a little while you get to grips with the situation.

 

[Gilberdyke John]

Thank you nobodies for your help, when help was needed someone stepped forward and i will be forever in his dept, i thought this place was to help people, sadly i think not unless you have a degree in this and that or in the clique .

Come on Millet, chill. All parts of the UK seem to have been seeing elevated levels of swarming activity and a lot of beekeepers are running out of equipment to hold swarms in. Your post above hints someone has helped out or am I misinterpreting? If you are still wanting a means to keep going and offer to house a swarm (or two) I'm sure someone in reach will step forward. There's also any number of beekeeping groups on facebook with people looking to find homes for bees, either with or without money changing hands.
I took a call from one of my mentees from last year asking if I knew where she could pass on a swarm but she's near Selby which is a long way from you.
Good luck