Pollination contracts

[Curly green finger's]

Hi, I'm after some advice on how much you would charge for taking hives to apple orchards for the spring as part of a pollination contract.
Info: some one I know is retiring and has asked me if I would like to take hives to cider apple orchards, he is a family member of the cider farm and has been taking 2 hives per field but being a family member has not been charging anything and keeping all the honey from the orchards which has been a mix of apple orchard /osr/ field bean and generally spring honey.

I have some figures of production per colony but being as looking around there isn't so much osr this coming spring these will differ somewhat.

The cider farm would like to sell the honey in there shop and online that is produced,
And are very interested in also selling our honey that we produce on the hill.

Your thoughts pls.
Pm me if you like.
Thanks
Mark.

 

[ericbeaumont]

I reckon that from a marketing point it's worth doing, Mark, although the farm shop retail price must be sensible. Depends also on the distance but I'm assuming the orchards are in your neck of the woods; could you leave them there all year?

Give Alex Ellis at the BFA a ring; if he knows you're considering such work they may look more kindly on your membership application.

Whether the sums add up or not, the experience gained will be worth far more.

 

[Antipodes]

I've found that orchards are a bit tricky and are not necessarily easy to get honey from ...one thing is because the colonies are not big enough at that time of year. I don't feed my bees sugar syrup so that could have an impact but the other thing is of course that the bees are feeding a lot of brood at that time of year, so use pretty much everything coming in for themselves.

 

[Michael Palmer]

I pollinated apples for 20 years, with 600 colonies each spring. I never made any honey in the orchards. Apple pollination really beats up the bees...and the equipment and the help. The bees dwindled on moving into the orchard, losing some of their population...not losing any brood volume though. Hard to say if it was just from moving or if it was from pesticides. After pollination was done for the year, and the bees were back in their apiaries, the populations had seemingly recovered from the moves. The resulting honey crop and wintering success said differently. Over those years, good years and bad, I figure I lost a medium super (40 pounds) of honey on every colony that moved to apples and back. I also estimate I lost 15-20% more colonies in the winter following pollination when comparing the colonies that pollinated and those that stayed in their apiaries.

I wouldn't pollinate apples again for all the tea in China. If you do, you shouldn't, in my opinion, accept anything less than $100/colony.

 

[Curly green finger's]

@ericbeaumont the cider farm is 40 mins drive away so not to far away.
@Antipodes I try and also not feed mine in the spring but use as many stored frames of honey/pollen as possible.
If I do feed its fondant.
@Michael Palmer thanks Michael this is what I was thinking.
I would be taking bees from pesticide free apiarys as 5/7 are pesticide free.

The crop that has been achieved in the past by the present beek would of been from osr/field beans and spring honey in general.
I've not Seen one field in the area this autumn, but the teme Valley is a very good area for spring honey in general and I have a friend who has 50 or so colonys by the river which do really well permanent sites though.

For £60 a hive I would rather just sell my own honey from the Clee to the shop as this next season it will be £7 - £8 for 340g.. And concentrating on getting it marketed with new labels... There's not many areas in the country that have farmers in a 70 mile radius that don't spray or put manure or fertilisers on there fields..
One will concentrate on my amms and Clee honey.

Thanks all for the advice..i Don't really like the idea of taking my girls to flowers that get sprayed anyway there to precious.

 

[elainemary]

Apple nectar has one of the lower sugar contents, which is why bees will choose other higher sugar forage nearby eg osr and field beans. Interesting though, Curly

 

[Curly green finger's]

Apple nectar has one of the lower sugar contents, which is why bees will choose other higher sugar forage nearby eg osr and field beans. Interesting though, Curly

Yes definitely interesting.. I suppose all the osr in the area has played a big part to how much honey crop has been achieved in the past..
The lack of it around is going to hit a lot of beeks moving bees around the country.
This season our two apiarys that are at lower levels contributed to about a third of what we extracted ( ors) bairing in mind these are also close to Heather and perminent sites and have good summer honey flows any way.

After what Michael has said and thinking about it, I can see why the beek maybe doesn't want to carry on with taking hives to the cider farm..
Im trying to find out his amount of losses per annum.. Funny though this hasn't been talked about.

Respect to those beekeepers who chase forage it must be a head ache and very testing on the bees.

 

[ericbeaumont]

Apple nectar has one of the lower sugar contents

Pear is even lower. If dandelion is in flower the bees ignore the fruit until the farmer mows.

 

[Curly green finger's]

Pear is even lower. If dandelion is in flower the bees ignore the fruit until the farmer mows.

Dandelion has a very high sugar content one of the highest.. Ie glucose, sucrose, and fructose.
Does anyone have a graph of the different percentages.??
I now that the different types of sugars change in quantity through out the season I did see a graph somewhere it might even of been on here.?

 

[Apple]

We have a number of apiary sites that are located so the allow the bees to pollinate the land owners orchards, as these are also well managed for our usual multifloral & wildflower meadow, Cornish forage, and quite often soft fruit as well, we take the honey and give an allowance to the landowner of 1 pound of honey per honey producing colony. Access and security must be good and the colonies must not be close to the public ( Roads Footpahts etc) or housing!

As above with moving around the country for pollination services... not worth the diesel!


Nadelik Lowen

 

[North End Bees]

I was offered a site in someone's orchard last year but when I mentioned it to a friend (who's a member of BFA) she said there had been reports of high incidences of CBPV in bees sited in orchards. So I declined.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I was offered a site in someone's orchard last year but when I mentioned it to a friend (who's a member of BFA) she said there had been reports of high incidences of CBPV in bees sited in orchards. So I declined.

Never heard that - the only 'High Incidences' of CBPV I've seen reported by the BFA have been in imported Danish queens.

 

[Jimmy]

I have two permanent apiaries on commercial apple/pear/plum orchards, neither of which I'd be willing to give up readily. Dandelions supplement the early top fruit blossom, there is clover in the grass during the summer and brambles in the surrounding hedgerows. There is good vehicle access (not 4x4) in all but the wettest conditions and there is a locked gate so peace of mind regarding hive security. They yield as much as other apiaries situated on farmland.
I have not had any problems with sprays.

 

[North End Bees]

Never heard that - the only 'High Incidences' of CBPV I've seen reported by the BFA have been in imported Danish queens.

I'll have a look back to see if I can find the email she forwarded me if it's still lurking somewhere. It should have more details. Referred to high numbers of CBPV in orchards in Essex/Kent.

 

[Swarm]

I'd suspect bee type rather than apples.

 

[Erichalfbee]

I'd suspect bee type rather than apples.

Yes Buckfast of Danish lineage I have heard rumours of

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Yes Buckfast of Danish lineage I have heard rumours of

That is the line they have identified as having issues, but the study isn't complete yet

 

[ericbeaumont]

reports of high incidences of CBPV in bees sited in orchards. So I declined.

Why blame orchards? After all, bees have been taken to orchards forever and a day. I agree with JBM & Swarm: more likely cause would be the type of bee, or perhaps a trigger to stress colonies - travel, for example.

I'd do as Jimmy: keep such sites permanent.

 

[North End Bees]

Why blame orchards? After all, bees have been taken to orchards forever and a day. I agree with JBM & Swarm: more likely cause would be the type of bee, or perhaps a trigger to stress colonies - travel, for example.

I'd do as Jimmy: keep such sites permanent.

I wish I could find the info from the time. All I remember is that there were reports of high incidences of CBPV associated with hives in orchards in the Essex/Kent area.
Ok it may have been a particular type of bee but how likely is it that all the beekeepers affected had the same bees?
Again possibly travel stress, but other colonies were also being moved about, e.g to osr.

 

[Curly green finger's]

I wish I could find the info from the time. All I remember is that there were reports of high incidences of CBPV associated with hives in orchards in the Essex/Kent area.
Ok it may have been a particular type of bee but how likely is it that all the beekeepers affected had the same bees?
Again possibly travel stress, but other colonies were also being moved about, e.g to osr.

Im trying to understand the stress issues with moving bees to different forage.
Im told that moving from certain types of forage one after another isn't good.
All depending what they are.
Is there a relative difference?

Eg osr to clover
Or clover to borage
Borage to Heather