Paynes Poly

[Finman]

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One test, where I was put in, was "how fast wax moth larvae go through the poly box".

Funny thing but there are diffencies between in materials of different companies.


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[PBee]

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One test, where I was put in, was "how fast wax moth larvae go through the poly box".

Funny thing but there are diffencies between in materials of different companies.


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Any experience with the relative merits of Paradise Honey and Honeypaw boxes ?. I have samples of both here but not in use yet. The honeypaw ones seem marginally harder but unfortunately do not do Dadant Blatt.

 

[drstitson]

PB - how come you're on DB rather than US Dadant or Modified Dadant?

 

[Finman]

Any experience with the relative merits of Paradise Honey and Honeypaw boxes ?. I have samples of both here but not in use yet. The honeypaw ones seem marginally harder but unfortunately do not do Dadant Blatt.

I have not used Honey Paw boxes and I will not because it is a new modell.

I do not remember how long I have used Paradise boxes, but long. Its business place is near my route when I go to my fee farm in summer cottage.

Boath companies are good. Paradise has 3000 hives and Honey Paw has 1000 hives. Boath owners are like "fire and flash!"- guys. Hard workers and great humour.

 

[PBee]

PB - how come you're on DB rather than US Dadant or Modified Dadant?

The grass is always greener........
At the time of changing from the National/Commercial monopoly DB and associated accessories seemed to be more widely available in France where I was looking as I have pidgin french - only understandable by myself it turns out. I also wasn't that clear on the differences in the Dadant variants until I recieved a consignment of Dadant frames from Graze in Germany which wouldn't fit in my Dadant boxes
BTW the progression over the years has been single BB nationals - Commercials - Double BB Nationals - Single BB Dadants and this spring for a while I toyed with the idea of Langstroth 3/4 (Farrar) throughout because of the Honey paw boxes and their move from Full depth Langstroth to Farrar. I seem to be following very closely the young Jim ryhme which I'm sure most will have heard but just in case....

At 20 young Jim was so full of vim he knew that full depths were the size for him.
At 40 with hundreds of hives of bees he thought he'd do better with W.S.P.'s.
At 60 with old age hard on his heels his slipped disc and muscles called out for ideals.
Now junior Jim has ordered supplies to rebox the lot in the Full Depth size.

Australian rhyme from Donald Sims book. Full Depth(9 1/8in), W.S.P. (7 1/8in) Ideal (5 1/4in).

 

[drstitson]

that explains it - france and italy both do things a bit differently re dadants.

FYI if swapping over to paradise (MB) jumbos you just need to put a couple of screws into the ends of the lugs to keep the DB frames in place.

 

[PBee]

that explains it - france and italy both do things a bit differently re dadants.

FYI if swapping over to paradise (MB) jumbos you just need to put a couple of screws into the ends of the lugs to keep the DB frames in place.

They do Dadant Blatt in their older Honey Series which is much better with flat tops to the boxes and so interchangeable with other equipment. I'm going to use Honey Paw floors, feeders and roofs with Paradise Honey DB broods and supers. They also have a nice T shaped frame runner which pushes into a slot in the rebate of the box making it easy to scrape off propolis. Honey Paw also do a floor (reversible floor) which may be an improvement over full OMF's in the ventilation/insulation debate . They have a poly drawer with a vent space at both sides over an open mesh. In summer the floor is close to the frames to help brooding and reduce burr comb and the vents are large at the sides. In winter the poly drawer is reversed and the floor is further from the bottom of the frames and sloped to smaller vents at the sides. I'll see how they work this year as against their solid poly floor.

 

[Poly Hive]

Actually allowing the bees to build comb in the recess in the floor is doubly advantageous.

1. Is that they draw considerably less drone brood on the combs.

2. Is that you can dispose of the drone brood easily by slicing it from the bottom bars, disposing of considerable amounts of mites into the bargain.

Something to keep in mind.

PH

 

[itma]

Actually allowing the bees to build comb in the recess in the floor is doubly advantageous.
...

What size floor to frame gap are you referring to for this provident wild comb, please?

 

[drstitson]

presumably something along the lines of the german deep floors (6cm) rather than more typical shallow vs deep comb method.

 

[Poly Hive]

Bottom bar to mesh on the Swienty floor is 40mm.

PH

 

[itma]

Thanks! Food for thought ...

 

[Into the lions den]

Actually allowing the bees to build comb in the recess in the floor is doubly advantageous.

??? Not many people place the grid under the recess, almost all fit it on top of the hole, so wild comb construction is normally zero, although a little can be built if the mesh is a bit saggy.

 

[Into the lions den]

They do Dadant Blatt in their older Honey Series which is much better with flat tops to the boxes and so interchangeable with other equipment. I'm going to use Honey Paw floors, feeders and roofs with Paradise Honey DB broods and supers..

Just be really really careful regarding compatibility. Some makes do not marry well with other makes, especially with regards to the bee space. MOST makes are simple top bee space versions, really just a fat walled version of the wooden hive, and as you progress you can shop around knowing that there is a choice of supplier.

Some makers do special variants, and half bee space top and bottom was one I saw in Denmark recently supplied from Finland and the buyer was not a happy bunny as he did not know that was what was going to arrive and it was giving him a lot of issues, especially as his lids then crushed things on the topbars. I understand Paradise honey DO supply standard and special versions, or at least used to. Just be sure you get what you want. Apart from that they are a quality maker.

 

[Poly Hive]

ITLD?

They may well do but I do it the other way by reason of the stated advantages as I see them.

The first polys I had, the German make, had an even bigger recess and it worked very well esp if I wanted more drones for mating purposes. Though the weakness was the rather flimsy mesh which meant more than one return visit to change floors.

PH

 

[Into the lions den]

ITLD?

The first polys I had, the German make, had an even bigger recess and it worked very well esp if I wanted more drones for mating purposes.

As you know our primary Langstroth unit uses these very German 'Kombi' floors you used before. A great floor that has stood the test of time.

Yes, the recess in the middle for the mesh is indeed even deeper. We also discarded the (pretty crap) supplied meshes long ago and had our own cut from pretty strong stainless 10 guage mesh by United Wire in Edinburgh.

Only at the very start did we have meshes on the bottom and found working with them a 'right guddle' as they do not always draw the wild comb down into the recess along the line of the frames. Lots of cross or even diagonal comb, which drops off as you work it, and we had a few real near things with queens being down there and a bit of comb landing on top. The we had a visit from some Scandinavian and German beekeepers who laughed at this and *mostly* told me the mesh was on the wrong way although one said he did it that way too as he could stick a thymol tray in the recess.

 

[Poly Hive]

Oddly I have had very few go the awkward way and in general for me it's worked well. *shrug*

PH

 

[Into the lions den]

Oddly I have had very few go the awkward way and in general for me it's worked well. *shrug*

PH

About 4 out of 5 will do it the way you want..................the others?

I suppose we must have had a surfeit of cellphone masts/powerlines/ley lines/magnetic fields/imidacloprid/'foreignness'/hybridisation/buckfast wine/ etc etc etc

Maybe the interesting smelling smoker fuel was hemp rather than jute and the bees just wandered contentedy offline.........

 

[Poly Hive]

The others seem to go the way I want after trimming the comb. On my scale its not an issue.

PH

 

[drstitson]

ITLD - don't colonies "inherit" a preference? apparently.