Oxalic trickling losses after treatments

[Finman]

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I noticed interesting thing from original OA treatment researches 2003.

In comparative hives, which were treated with mere 50% syrup, losses of bees were on average 40% (=smaller clusters).

Many say that they see dead bees on counting floors after treatment. They are dead bees here and there in the hive and when disturbed bees clean them down.

I have seen too that in April when bees try to fly in bad weathers, they may loose half of their clusters and it is bigger loss than during winter cluster.

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[oliver90owner]

I see it in poorer colonies, but the winter attrition rate for a good, healthy and strong colony is not usually that great.

Maybe the dead bees are those that should not be wintering (a cold snap confined the non-winter bees to the hive, while strong brooding was still going on?). There again, maybe not. Perhaps it is all part of the oxalic treatment downside?

I still prefer alternative measures to a winter oxalic trickle - and it works fine for me.

 

[Finman]

I see it in poorer colonies, but the winter attrition rate for a good, healthy and strong colony is not usually that great.
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yes, here we are again. The world does not need any bee researching. Ask from Oliver if you want something new to know.

You even know the reasons of winter losses in different countries. That results above were from Sweden.

Vain job that COLOSS PROJECT



Oliver. I can tell to you my experiences. Nosema can reduce cluster size even 80% and 50% is very bad too. Bees just fly away from the hive and there are not much dead bees on floor.

I think that in UK bees seldom die inside the hive. If they are sick, they come out and fly away to die.

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[Finman]

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What is your snow cover now Oliver?

 

[Luminos]

Snow cover here is neige-ligable today...

 

[Winker]

yes, here we are again. The world does not need any bee researching. Ask from Oliver if you want something new to know.

You even know the reasons of winter losses in different countries. That results above were from Sweden.

Vain job that COLOSS PROJECT



Oliver. I can tell to you my experiences. Nosema can reduce cluster size even 80% and 50% is very bad too. Bees just fly away from the hive and there are not much dead bees on floor.

I think that in UK bees seldom die inside the hive. If they are sick, they come out and fly away to die.

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What's so wrong with doing our own thing and seeing the results we get? I have not put OA on any of my main 22 hives this year, but I did do it to 18 over wintering Nucs.

What if in the spring my main 22 hives all get through the winter and get off to a good start? Does that tell me that OA is not needed?

What if all 22 hives go on to have a successful year and go into next winter strong?

What if some of the Nuc's die that got the OA and none of the main hives do, what conclusions should I draw?

Why do we have to except what others say with out trying for our self?

 

[masterBK]

Lets all ignore the experiences of others and re-invent the wheel!

 

[Finman]

What's so wrong with doing our own thing and

Why do we have to except what others say with out trying for our self?

You are an adult person. Of course you do what you want. And you MUST do because you are allways responsible about your doings.

When Oliver goes his personal war against ocxalic, and deliver his wrong advices, what's wrong in that? The guys is only stupid and what is wrong in that? He has got his penalty allready.


----what others say with out trying for our self.......That is the most stupid way to learn things. Look! EU varroa Group made 10 years work and you do not mind about those things. You want to repeat all mistakes. That is called stupid if you cannot learn from another's mistakes.

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[Winker]

----what others say with out trying for our self.......That is the most stupid way to learn things. Look! EU varroa Group made 10 years work and you do not mind about those things. You want to repeat all mistakes. That is called stupid if you cannot learn from another's mistakes.

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I think you will find were a nation of people who like trying things for our self to see what results we get. Our curiosity has lead to some of the worlds most used inventions. Its what we do, try it our way and see what results we get...

 

[victor meldrew]

Still a lot of mileage in the old saying
A wise man learns by his mistakes,
A wiser man learns by the mistakes of others
VN

 

[Winker]

Still a lot of mileage in the old saying
A wise man learns by his mistakes,
A wiser man learns by the mistakes of others
VN

I agree, but in this case the adage can be applied to both side. If all of my 22 hives come though spring/summer/autumn to next winter with good results and go on to over winter next year with successful results without the use of OA, what results do I conclude?

I am not saying that OA treatment does not work, we all know it works. But the bigger question is, do we need to use it?

 

[victor meldrew]

I have used it to great effect this year but it isn't my first choice .
I missed the window for Thymol treatment (Indian summer)so fell back onto OA, judging by the mite drop, I think I made the correct decision ?
VM

 

[Finman]

I think you will find were a nation of people who like trying things for our self to see what results we get. ...

Beekeeping as a hobby is a thing where you can do many things your own.

wood works with table saw, extracting things, selling, marketing, hiding taxes, meet friends and enemies... In some scale it is interesting to do and learn closely.

But after my 50 years as a beekeeper motives to do things are hard to find. like drinking tar. In human life there much thigs what to do.

Should I do mistake that for that I have something interesting to do?


10-15 years more, and perhaps every morning is new. Every friend is new.
it is called dementia.

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[Winker]

I have used it to great effect this year but it isn't my first choice .
I missed the window for Thymol treatment (Indian summer)so fell back onto OA, judging by the mite drop, I think I made the correct decision ?
VM

I did the same with 18 Nuc's. But i didn't have to use OA with my main 22 hives i had a successful Thymol treatment in Autumn and im sure with other things i do through out the year that I wont need to use it.

I dont buy into the idea of, our bees will die unless we do it.

Oxalic Acid has its place in beekeeping, but by no means do you have to open your hive in the dead of winter and soak your bees in it, like Finman would leave us to believe.

 

[Winker]

But after my 50 years as a beekeeper
it is called dementia.

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Its 51 years now, last year you kept making a point of telling me you had 50 years expeance, you're right dementia is catching up...Just saying

 

[Moggs]

Are we bound by rules? And winter? I really doubt whether the opening of a hive for less than a minute in these unseasonably warm temperatures would worry a healthy colony one bit! Many posts on here reflect that bees are flying (though we are in for a cool spell apparently).

Why treat with OA if it's not needed? I doubt whether many of us would self-administer paracetomol without symptoms of cold and flu for example.

Treat the problem not the advice!

 

[Finman]

Its 51 years now, last year you kept making a point of telling me you had 50 years expeance, you're right dementia is catching up...Just saying

11 days is not a year. After next summer I date a count. It was about 25.6. when I started with catching a swarm.

haha hah ha

 

[PBee]

10-15 years more, and perhaps every morning is new. Every friend is new.
it is called dementia.

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What happens when you have to scale back and become a two hive owner?

ONO has a point with the winter oxalic treatment - it is an extra stressor at a vunerable time. I use it at the moment but always with trepidation as I have lost a couple of hives due to nosema after treatment. In my opinion it was the main factor as, whilst nosema is endemic, it very rarely expresses itself as losses - in my experience. There may have been other aggravating factors but, due to the timing and low incidence, in those few cases the oxalic seems to have tipped the scales.

 

[Drew]

yes, here we are again. The world does not need any bee researching. Ask from Oliver if you want something new to know.

Is it only me who sometimes feels like shouting:

"Finman look over there - a Black Pot!!"

Only asking

 

[Finman]

Is it only me who sometimes feels like shouting:

"Finman look over there - a Black Pot!!"

Only asking

We have different climate. It does not concern us.

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